OSR A Historical Look at the OSR

[Malmuria]

I'm also talking about OSE.

I literally just bought three OSE rulebooks brand new from Exalted Funeral, so your comments that "Bummer the only copy of the game is on ebay at $240. I bought the pdf but I'm more of a book person. So thousands of modules but nobody is publishing more of the rule books, we have to wait for each kickstarter" are super confusing to me. The rulebooks are available for sale, not just modules.

Yep, here it is:

Old-School Essentials Classic Fantasy Rules Tome

The Complete Classic Fantasy Game in One Book The Classic Fantasy Rules Tome is a complete game with the following content: Character options: Seven classic classes (cleric, dwarf, elf, fighter, halfling, magic-user, thief), complete lists of weapons and adventuring gear, extensive lists of...

www.exaltedfuneral.com

They seem to go out of stock quickly though

 

[Greggy C]

I'm also talking about OSE.

I literally just bought three OSE rulebooks brand new from Exalted Funeral, so your comments that "Bummer the only copy of the game is on ebay at $240. I bought the pdf but I'm more of a book person. So thousands of modules but nobody is publishing more of the rule books, we have to wait for each kickstarter" are super confusing to me. The rulebooks are available for sale, not just modules.

I mean I see "OSE stuff" on that website, but not the boxed set or the all encompasing rules tomb. Its actually a little confusing figuring out what you want, some many books, so many versions (I think).

 

[Greggy C]

Yep, here it is:

Old-School Essentials Classic Fantasy Rules Tome

The Complete Classic Fantasy Game in One Book The Classic Fantasy Rules Tome is a complete game with the following content: Character options: Seven classic classes (cleric, dwarf, elf, fighter, halfling, magic-user, thief), complete lists of weapons and adventuring gear, extensive lists of...

www.exaltedfuneral.com

They seem to go out of stock quickly though

ok, I ordered it, never would have found it without the links

 

[Greggy C]

You know that Oliver LeGrand actually did make a game called Mazes & Minotaurs, which was based off of OD&D, but set in Greek mythology instead of Tolkien-ish fantasy? The first edition was released before OSRIC and the rest of the clones. The blog posts that started this thread references it.

But to answer your larger question, it goes back to the roots of where OSRIC came from. They wanted to publish supplements for 1e AD&D. They weren't looking to make a brand new 1e-ish game. If that's what they'd wanted, there was already Hackmaster, Castles & Crusades, Palladium FRPG, and literally dozens of others, or just hacking up 3e to fit their needs for that matter.

Thats cool, makes sense, I'm not so much into the greek stuff, I need serious, studious wizards. I heard of C&C in passing, I'll check it out.

 

[Jack Daniel]

There are enough little changes in LL that it's more different than I like, but it's definitely a good game.

They're mostly pretty good changes IMO. Expanded weapon and armor lists, a clerical spell progression that looks more like AD&D, and (most especially) MUs getting to add spells to their books as they find them? Threaten me with a good time…

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Thats cool, makes sense, I'm not so much into the greek stuff, I need serious, studious wizards. I heard of C&C in passing, I'll check it out.

If it hasn't been posted already, this has been a great resourse-

D&D Retroclones

 

[rogueattorney]

They're mostly pretty good changes IMO. Expanded weapon and armor lists, a clerical spell progression that looks more like AD&D, and (most especially) MUs getting to add spells to their books as they find them? Threaten me with a good time…

I haven't done a real close side-by-side between OSE and B/X. My brief look made it seem like the exact same thing. I'm sure there may be some slight textual nuances here and there, but it certainly appeared spot on to me.

I did do a pretty in-depth side by side between LL and B/X when LL came out however many years ago, and the two big changes that stuck out to me enough to still remember was the significantly higher price for plate mail and the different cleric spell chart that gave cleric spells from first level.

 

[Mannahnin]

OSE is basically identical to B/X, plus the option of ascending AC.

Labyrinth Lord is full of little changes, some of which can be surprising toe-stubs when running it.

• The expanded weapon and armor options strike me as mostly redundant.
• Clerics getting a spell at 1st level I can take or leave, although them not having one does have some worldbuilding utility in terms of Acolytes as a monster and NPCs. It also makes them less of "just a better Fighter" at 1st level if you're running a one shot.
• The expanded higher levels (up to 20th) and higher level spells... In some games might be useful.
• The flipped reaction tables and altered treasure and encounter tables are some of the more annoying bits; they reduce compatibility when running modules written for the original games.

I 100% agree with liking MUs and Elves to be able to add found spells to their books. That was IMO a rare editorial miss on Tom Moldvay's part, and I normally house-rule that one. OSE offers it as a house rule in their Advanced Fantasy rules, overall doing a very nice job implementing an "AD&D, but simpler" set of expanded rules for spell books there.

 

[Neonchameleon]

This is exactly what I was discussing. There is nothing more aggravating (IMO) when you're trying to have a conversation than the person who barges in and says a variant of-
"How dare you call it Skilled Play? My game is skilled!"
"How dare you call it OSR? My game is old school!"
"How dare you call it Story Now? My game has stories!"

♫ One of these things is not like the other ones. One of these things doesn't belong. ♫

In specific I'm not aware that anyone talks about lower case "old school renaissance" in any other context, and although you could make a demand like "we want story now" but it's a very rare sentence and sentiment that makes that a demand. Skilled play on the other hand, not used as a proper noun, happens in every conceivable gaming context.

People don't, in my experience, object to the Old School Rennaissance being a thing. They object when OSR supporters try to implicitly claim that all old school gaming is their style rather than that they are one subset of old school gaming; I've very rarely seen the objection crop up as long as the OSR fans stick to the term of art rather than make an implicit grab for the whole of the term "old school" and drop the R. Skilled play calling itself such a generic term feels like an attempt to claim a generic term for themselves. And I've never seen even the most narrative-heavy White Wolf gamers objecting to the specific construct "Story-Games" because it's clearly and obviously a specific term meaning a specific thing.

 

[Sacrosanct]

If it hasn't been posted already, this has been a great resourse-

D&D Retroclones

Man, what's a fella gotta do to make that list with their OSR game? I've got about 1000 copies sold since last fall of Chromatic Dungeons lol