D&D General A History of Violence: Killing in D&D

edit: if where was actually a nuanced set of social combat mechanics and classes all had their own abilities that could impact things wouldn't we probably see alot more purely social games.
I have yet to come across a set of social combat mechanics I enjoy, but that's just me.

And it's not because I'm too used to combat in RPGs, the Storyteller system was the first one I ever played and I prefer face characters.
 

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And social combat is still combat. Complex and nuanced system for social combat is still complex and nuanced combat system. You just replace physical harm with emotional damage or reputation damage. If anybody remembers combat from old Monkey Island games, that would be it, more or less.

Epic rap battles - ttrpg edition. :D
 

I think another aspect on whether the D&D mechanics incentivize combat is the divide between combat as fantasy Vietnam war or combat as sport.

The deadliness of combat has an impact on whether players are disincentivized to attack things even though there are mechanics for it.

Even in more deadly older D&D this changed along a spectrum within the game from the super vulnerable low levels where most everything can potentially take you out in one hit to high level high hp combat where you can have multiple round superhero fights with fighters cleaving through squads of enemies and magic users artillery fireballing groups of enemies, even though save or die could still one shot PCs and there was death at 0 hp.
 

i'd say it's a very much 'chicken and egg' scenario, is there more mechanics because combat more fun or is combat more fun because there's more mechanics dedicated to resolving it.

I think there's at least two other factors in play:

1. As I've noted before, combat is one of the easiest things in a game to have everyone participate in. Its not impossible to do with other things, but often its a case with many of those that participants other than specialists are actively counterproductive, or where only a sharply limited number of people (sometimes only one) can participate at all. As such mechanics tend to gravitate to it.

2. Its also one of the processes if it goes badly to be most likely to lose someone a character, so there's an incentive for being a lot of points-of-decision in it.
 

And social combat is still combat. Complex and nuanced system for social combat is still complex and nuanced combat system. You just replace physical harm with emotional damage or reputation damage. If anybody remembers combat from old Monkey Island games, that would be it, more or less.

Epic rap battles - ttrpg edition. :D

Social interaction systems don't have to be just the most combat-like elements though; they can be used for extracting information or persuading people to cooperate. The more aggressive uses are just a subset.
 

I think another aspect on whether the D&D mechanics incentivize combat is the divide between combat as fantasy Vietnam war or combat as sport.

The deadliness of combat has an impact on whether players are disincentivized to attack things even though there are mechanics for it.

Even in more deadly older D&D this changed along a spectrum within the game from the super vulnerable low levels where most everything can potentially take you out in one hit to high level high hp combat where you can have multiple round superhero fights with fighters cleaving through squads of enemies and magic users artillery fireballing groups of enemies, even though save or die could still one shot PCs and there was death at 0 hp.

I've seen this argument before, but, well, I saw an awful lot of combat in RuneQuest over the years, and that could be pretty deadly even for the experienced if things went well. I think a lot of it has to do with the degree of attachment people form to starting characters as much as anything.
 

I've seen this argument before, but, well, I saw an awful lot of combat in RuneQuest over the years, and that could be pretty deadly even for the experienced if things went well. I think a lot of it has to do with the degree of attachment people form to starting characters as much as anything.
It is also a personal style thing.

Some people approached early D&D as creep along looking for traps, and trying to avoid fighting monsters unless you can get a sweet ambush.

Others in early D&D loved to kick in doors and charge cleaving left and right.
 




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