Ampersand: Sneak Attack

[Archangel_Zer0]

Something Witty Here.

I'm definitely hoping this is simply an incomplete preview, simply for the fact that some terms need defining, and without the complete set of character creation rules set along with this, makes it hard to descern what's truly in and what's actually out.

And as to Epochrpg,
I'm sure there is a decent explanation for this percieved whomping of armor's usefulness. If not.... well, every system/edition's got to have something completely broken in it, right? Isn't it a rule somewhere? So they have something to fix with errata and such?

Either way, wow... that would completely suck for anyone going toe-to-toe with a Rogue (who happened to have Piercing Strike, and if this is the case, what Rogue wouldn't have it?).

IMHO, Homebrew Optional/Additional Rules create a certain joy in me, so if this is the case, a worthwhile DM will be able to deal with these problems easily, or an experienced player will be able to deal with it in conjunction with said DM.

Then again, I also happen to believe that any truly worthwhile DM has at least a few homebrew rules they impliment into any gaming system.


Peace, Love and Bloodstains,
~ Me.

PS - Don't mind me, I'm kinda nuts.

 

[Sammael]

Don't worry, fighters will probably have a power called Defy Piercing Strike, which will allow them to add 1/2 of their armor bonus to Ref against Piercing Strike. Then, come Complete Martial, there will be a rogue power called Penetrate Advanced Defense, which will negate fighters' Defy Piercing Strike. In Complete Martial II, fighters will make a comeback, and so on, and so forth...

 

[Mouseferatu]

OMG. I already found something totally broken! Armor is now worthless if you are fighting a rogue. At will they can AUTOMATICALLY bypass your armor! AUTOMATICALLY. Well I can guess people will be saying how totally screwed over Fighters are by the current edition... all over again!

Yes, because seeing this power as part of a preview, without knowing what other powers or combat rules are in place, places one in a perfect position to decide what's broken.

As someone who's been playing a rogue in 4E for months now, let me assure you that while it's a nice power to have, it's not even remotely game-breaking. In fact, I think it's the at-will power I've used least, of those I've chosen.

 

[mach1.9pants]

Don't worry, fighters will probably have a power called Defy Piercing Strike, which will allow them to add 1/2 of their armor bonus to Ref against Piercing Strike. Then, come Complete Martial, there will be a rogue power called Penetrate Advanced Defense, which will negate fighters' Defy Piercing Strike. In Complete Martial II, fighters will make a comeback, and so on, and so forth...

You are a bitter, twisted man..errm ...archdevil...

Edit:And LOL, the Mouseferatu post above!

 

[MaelStorm]

@ Mouseferatu

I'm really happy with the preview. And, yes, the tactical choices are definitely going to make 4E one notch above all the previous editions.

 

[Darth Cyric]

As someone who's been playing a rogue in 4E for months now, let me assure you that while it's a nice power to have, it's not even remotely game-breaking. In fact, I think it's the at-will power I've used least, of those I've chosen.

So I take it it's not exactly the equivalent of a Persisted Wraithstrike or Find the Gap? Because those spells got quite nasty.

What about Positioning Strike with Artful Dodger? That's the main one that gave me pause. (It's a per-encounter strike, I know, but I've thought up a few situations where it could be pretty insane).

 

[fuindordm]

Excellent article! I'm going to enjoy the new rogue, I can tell.

Skills:

I'm really happy to see that the social skills haven't been bundled. I think having separate ones really encouraged PCs to role-play (a nice incentive to use the kind of interaction you're good at).

Weapons:

I note that most of the powers rely on "light blades". I hope there are also powers that rely on other kinds of weapons, or that can be used with any weapon. Key example: Positioning Strike. Why should that one depend on what weapon you're using?

Powers:

Crimson Edge: So, is that "half damage on a miss" supposed to mean ([2W]+Dex)/2, ([W]+Dex)/2, or [W]+Dex? I could make a case for any one.

 

[Kirnon_Bhale]

Something I just noticed about the preview and have not seen mentioned.

Sneak attack: ....when you have combat advantage against an enemy and are using a light blade, a crossbow, or a sling....

Take a little time to learn how to use a Heavy or Regular crossbow and you will have some hefty range on your sneak attack. Not sure how you would work in combat advantage at such a distance - barring First Strike or perhaps Crimson Edge with a quick teleported retreat perhaps. However I am sure that it is a viable strategy.

 

[Darth Cyric]

Key example: Positioning Strike. Why should that one depend on what weapon you're using?

Hmm, well I thought of it as the Rogue making the "false stumble" to mislead his target. If he really sells it (hits the target's Will), then the target is mislead in the direction the Rogue intends and stumbles in that direction, and then all of a sudden the Rogue sneaks the other way, hamstrings the target with his light blade (hard to do with any other type of weapon) and uses the target's momentum as well as the pain from the hamstringing to send his target in the desired direction.

 

[TheArcane]

I, too, hope that this is a limited preview, mainly because there are clearly a ton more powers available for selection, but also because this article has absolutely zero non-combat reference. I'm not just talking about social combat, I mean that all that's written here is "combat this" and "combat that", as if the character class exists purely to fight. This bothers me especially because this is the rogue class, which has a lot of potential for interesting non-combat fluff and even mechanics. I really hope that the PHB entry contains more fluff and background, although I guess my hopes for non-combat mechanical differencs between classes are going to be shattered. A lack of background, motivation, other fluff writeup would be pretty ironic, in light of the ever so restricted weapon and skill choises.

Also, I'm hoping for another rogue tactic. Only two seems a little lacking, three would offer more variety. Surely they can find another rogue archtype besides "thug" and "dodger". Although if you take only combat styles into consideration, as the developers obviously did, there's probably little more to find.

There are things that I do like. The powers look imaginitive and varied, the HP progression looks nicely balanced with average 3E die rolls with approximately expected CON bonus for the class. I'm still worried about combat complexity, and the regular attack seems pretty obsolete with all these at-will powers, but I guess only playing it will give me an accurate impression.