Attribute Score Generation - How Do You Do It?

[Herremann the Wise]

I'm sure there are a hundred of these threads out there but not having seen any, I thought I'd start my own.

Rolling Attributes

Do you guys just get your players to roll as per book, use the point buy method or something more fancy?

Having used several methods, I've settled on the following system. It builds upon the point buy method but offers a little flexibility for those players who like to gamble.

Essentially, you may buy either a fixed attribute score or an attribute roll. However, you must place the roll into the attribute before you roll it. It is as follows:

{Cost}
{0} 8 or 4d6 Remove Highest
{1} 9 or 5d6 Reroll 1's and Remove two Highest
{2} 10 or 3d6
{3} 11 or 5d6 Reroll 1's, 2's and Remove two Highest
{4} 12 or 4d6 Remove Lowest
{5} 13 or 5d6 Remove two Lowest
{6} 14 or 6d6 Remove three Lowest
{8} 15 or 5d6 Reroll 1's, 2's and Remove two Lowest
{10} 16 or 6d6 Reroll 1's, 2's and Remove three Lowest
{13} 17
{16} 18

I like the power and balance of putting 26 points on offer. It makes the big stats feel more special yet still offers a few good choices making the character special.
As for the Rolls, each has been specially selected. With each roll, there is roughly a 50% chance to roll better than what you could have paid for. For example, you could pay 5 points for a 13 or a 5d6 Roll. With the roll, there is a 52.6% chance of getting 14 or better. However, the reverse of this is that you have 33.9% chance of getting a score 12 or lower. As such, it is a gamble but a reasonable gamble. It offers enough variety of fixed and random stats that most times, people will be happy with what they choose.

Anyway, that's my variation, how about yours?

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Ravellion]

Hmmmm at 25 points one could roll 5 out of 6 stats with 5d6 drop two lowest... which is very powerful indeed. Have you tested this?

Rav

 

[danzig138]

3d6 in order. If, after racial modifiers, extra points from higher levels, etc, your modifiers added up are negative, I usually allow a reroll. If your modifiers add up to 0 or higher, you keep what you have.

 

[Ravellion]

3d6 in order. If, after racial modifiers, extra points from higher levels, etc, your modifiers added up are negative, I usually allow a reroll. If your modifiers add up to 0 or higher, you keep what you have.

Why do you penalise higher level starting characters like that? WOuld you make him keep his scores if he could have made it 0 or better, but instead chose to raise diffeerent abilities which didn't reduce the penalty?

 

[ichabod]

Hmmmm at 25 points one could roll 5 out of 6 stats with 5d6 drop two lowest... which is very powerful indeed. Have you tested this?

Rav

By his system with 26 points, the median value for that would be 16 15 14 12 10 9, which would be 31 points. That is a significant jump. Even better, take 5 4d6 rolls, and a 6d6 roll, for 16, 15, 14, 12, 11, 9 median (32 points).

I don't know. I like the idea, but I think rolling might be too powerful. Herreman, do you have the distributions for the rolls where you reroll 1's and 2's? I'd like to look at this some more.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Here are the averages for Herremann's method. I've included the set value (left) and the rolled value (right):

0 8 8.755401235
1 9 9.584
2 10 10.5
3 11 11.60546875
4 12 12.24459877
5 13 13.43016975
6 14 14.27379115
8 15 15.39453125
10 16 15.94628906
13 17 -
16 18 -

I've included a more in-depth Excel file for those interested.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

I use Weighted Point-Buy, per the DMG, with 55 points.

 

[themaxx]

55 points? If you're using the system I think you are, that is a tremendous amount, isn't it? I don't think I've ever used weighted point buy with more than 36, and even those were hefty characters (but fun, in a Spycraft game). I usually keep the point buy between 28 and 36, which seems to work.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Thanks for the replies people.

Here's some extra detail as far as distributions are concerned.

Rav,

The 5d6 for 5 points looks like a good deal and is. However, if you have a look at the distribution, it fits in nicely with the theme of about 50% chance above the equivalent point buy.

Roll {Percentage}
3 {0.013%}
4 {0.064%}
5 {0.193%}
6 {0.527%}
7 {1.157%}
8 {2.186%}
9 {3.807%}
10 {6.044%}
11 {8.552%}
12 {11.330%}
13 {13.567%}
14 {14.853%}
15 {14.288%}
16 {12.024%}
17 {7.845%}
18 {3.549%}

Chance of getting above 13: {52.559%}
Chance of getting below 13: {33.873%}

This roughly characterises all the rolls - except for 6d6 Reroll 1's and 2's. By giving the opportunity to roll above what you could buy at 50% you encourage people to use the rolling choice for some stats. However, the pay off is that roughly 50% of the time, you will roll the same or lower. This combined with having to place the roll before the roll is made, gives just enough balance to the pro's and con's.

On average, rolling will turn out slightly better. However, it still provides a gamble in that you may spend a good handful of points yet get way under what those equivalent points could have bought. Having seen it in action, watching someone pay 6 points and getting a 5 for their money, you will find that players will choose a balance of the two. In essence, I would suggest people try it out if you're interested. I can promise you won't be dissappointed.

Ichabod,

The distributions for the reroll 1's and 2's are as follows:

5d6 Reroll 1's and 2's removing two lowest.
Roll {Percentage}
3 to 8 {0.000%}
9 {0.098%}
10 {0.488%}
11 {1.465%}
12 {4.004%}
13 {8.301%}
14 {14.160%}
15 {19.629%}
16 {22.949%}
17 {18.555%}
18 {10.352%}

Chance of getting below 15: {28.516%}
Chance of getting above 15: {51.855%}

Again, same as before being approximately 50% of the time greater than the point buy equivalent.

However, 6d6 Reroll 1's, 2's removing three lowest is a little different and is the black sheep of the rolling family:

Roll {Percentage}
3-8 {0.000%}
9 {0.024%}
10 {0.146%}
11 {0.513%}
12 {1.904%}
13 {4.907%}
14 {10.034%}
15 {17.041%}
16 {24.683%}
17 {23.804%}
18 {16.943%}

Chance of getting below 16: {34.570%}
Chance of getting above 16: {40.747%}

The chance of getting above 16 is about 41% or 10% lower than the other rolls. I left this one in because there is still about a 65% chance of getting a 16 or greater which I thought was reasonable. Some may disagree with this analysis though.

On the whole, it provides a little bit of variety from the point buy system which can tend to get a little stale for those bored easily.

Any other attribute rolling ideas?

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Xeriar]

1 million 3d6 sets (in order) - and I pick a level which I want to run the characters at - 1 in 10 is roughly equal to 25 point buy, whereas sometimes I feel 1 in 100,000 is better (or 1 in a million).