Avengers: Endgame SPOILER THREAD

Erekose

Adventurer
I enjoyed it but not as much as I enjoyed Infinity War - Endgame just wasn’t as coherent a film.

For a blockbuster film it was the quiet character moments that were the best - pretty much the first and last quarters of the film.

The only thing I particularly didn’t like was “Lebowski” Thor. Having him badly affected by Infinity War and pointlessly killing Thanos was interesting but it turned Thor into a joke character for virtually the whole of the remaining film (not withstanding the final fight with Thanos).

I’m sure it’s been mentioned elsewhere but I couldn’t quite see how Thanos with no Infinity stones could take on Iron Man, Thor, and Captain America (and with Thor having Stormbreaker and Mjolnir) ...
 
Last edited:

ccs

39th lv DM
Some of the team combos were a bit dumb too - like why were Hawkeye and Natasha sent to Vormir when neither had been in space before AND Black Widow would have been more valuable on the New York mission than Tony was?
Because since the 1st Avengers movie we've been told, and shown, that Clint & Natasha share a personal bond just not present with the rest of the characters present at that point in the film. So if you've got to sacrifice someone you care deeply about to get the Soul Stone what other pairing are you going to send?
Any other available character you pick had some arc/function/scene THEY were integral to later in the movie.
 

Ovinomancer

No flips for you!
I’m sure it’s been mentioned elsewhere but I couldn’t quite see how Thanos with no Infinity stones could take on Iron Man, Thor, and Captain America (and with Thor having Stormbreaker and Mjolnir) ...
Thanos pretty effortlessly beats the Hulk in IW, then goes on to almost beat the Stark/Strange/Spidey/GotG team ambush without the stones. Using the stones has a visible tell fir each stone -- everything else is straight up Thanos.
 

Flexor the Mighty!

18/100 Strength!
That was the equivalent of an old team up book event series with too many characters, poor writing, but very nice art. About 2 hours in I was thinking "I'm about ready to go..." And making Thor the comic relief wasn't my cup of tea. Haven't really enjoyed the last few Marvel flicks I've seen, admittedly that isn't very many of them. As a long term comic fan I think I'm about super hero movied out.

2 out of 5 flexes.
 

Istbor

Explorer
*shrug* I liked beer gut Thor.

One because, oh look the events of the past actually affected someone, and here are the results. The other is because I'm sure it totally miffed some people who couldn't wait to get another look at those pecks and abs. Heh.

Otherwise, it was enjoyable. I could have probably done without the time travel myself, but really, what else could they do once Thanos destroyed the stones?
 

Tonguez

Adventurer
Because since the 1st Avengers movie we've been told, and shown, that Clint & Natasha share a personal bond just not present with the rest of the characters present at that point in the film. So if you've got to sacrifice someone you care deeply about to get the Soul Stone what other pairing are you going to send?
Any other available character you pick had some arc/function/scene THEY were integral to later in the movie.
yeah, from a meta-perspective I liked the narrative drama of those two going, but "in game" it means the Avengers knew a sacrifice was needed and were willing to make one (which is a No on both fronts). A more logical team would have been Natasha goes to New York for the stealth mission with Antman and Capt, send Tony to the Wizard and send Hulk to Vormir.

Its a minor quibble though, I liked it...
 

Erekose

Adventurer
Thanos pretty effortlessly beats the Hulk in IW, then goes on to almost beat the Stark/Strange/Spidey/GotG team ambush without the stones. Using the stones has a visible tell fir each stone -- everything else is straight up Thanos.
Hmm - I’m not so sure. Thanos has the Power Stone already in Infinity War when he fights Hulk and it’s not until the beginning of Endgame where we see him fight without any Infinity Stones and he’s dealt with pretty easily (albeit he’s nearly died recently destroying the Infinity Stones).

Which begs the question of how the Avengers so easily handle the individual stones when collecting them in Endgame. Guardians of the Galaxy had an ending that showed what happens if your half-Celestial and half-human and handle a single stone!
 

Ovinomancer

No flips for you!
Hmm - I’m not so sure. Thanos has the Power Stone already in Infinity War when he fights Hulk and it’s not until the beginning of Endgame where we see him fight without any Infinity Stones and he’s dealt with pretty easily (albeit he’s nearly died recently destroying the Infinity Stones).

Which begs the question of how the Avengers so easily handle the individual stones when collecting them in Endgame. Guardians of the Galaxy had an ending that showed what happens if your half-Celestial and half-human and handle a single stone!
There's a visual tell whenever a power stone is used. Thanos doesn't use it against Hulk, and is prevented from doing so against the ambush (until he isn't). Everything without a glow-y stone effect is just Thanos.
 

Erekose

Adventurer
There's a visual tell whenever a power stone is used. Thanos doesn't use it against Hulk, and is prevented from doing so against the ambush (until he isn't). Everything without a glow-y stone effect is just Thanos.
Sorry I didn’t ignore you when you said this before and I agree that when a stone specific power is used there’s a visual tell. However, as Thanos adds each stone to the gauntlet he appears to get suffused with power that takes him a moment to control. I.e. I think he does get a more generic physical power-up as well as when he uses the stone specific powers.
 

Ovinomancer

No flips for you!
Sorry I didn’t ignore you when you said this before and I agree that when a stone specific power is used there’s a visual tell. However, as Thanos adds each stone to the gauntlet he appears to get suffused with power that takes him a moment to control. I.e. I think he does get a more generic physical power-up as well as when he uses the stone specific powers.
Well, it appears this is incorrect, as a zero stone Thanos appears to be capable of the same feats a multi-stone Thanos could do without the visual tells of stones activating. I mean, we could argue this, but I'd have to wonder if you're looking for consistency in the movie or just defending your prior assumptions.

Hulk and Tony both also had moments where they looked to be infused with power from the gauntlet, but that appeared to be more merely trying to survive the combined might of the stones, not a power-up, especially since neither of them evinced any greater ability or power afterwards.
 

Erekose

Adventurer
Well, it appears this is incorrect, as a zero stone Thanos appears to be capable of the same feats a multi-stone Thanos could do without the visual tells of stones activating. I mean, we could argue this, but I'd have to wonder if you're looking for consistency in the movie or just defending your prior assumptions.

Hulk and Tony both also had moments where they looked to be infused with power from the gauntlet, but that appeared to be more merely trying to survive the combined might of the stones, not a power-up, especially since neither of them evinced any greater ability or power afterwards.
Hmm ... maybe 😀
 

Rabulias

Adventurer
yeah, from a meta-perspective I liked the narrative drama of those two going, but "in game" it means the Avengers knew a sacrifice was needed and were willing to make one (which is a No on both fronts).
I have only seen it once so far, but I am not sure they knew a sacrifice would be required. All they know is what Nebula said: that Thanos took Gamora there and she did not come back with him. Nebula thinks he murdered her (true), but they might think Gamora made one last-ditch effort to stop Thanos from getting the stone and he killed her.

If they knew a sacrifice would be required, I think Cap would have volunteered to be the one to go.
 

Rabulias

Adventurer
Which begs the question of how the Avengers so easily handle the individual stones when collecting them in Endgame. Guardians of the Galaxy had an ending that showed what happens if your half-Celestial and half-human and handle a single stone!
Note that most of the stones are in containers (The Tessaract, The Orb, The Scepter, Rocket's syringe) that are safe to touch, and all the raw stones are manipulated by machines when put into Tony's Infinity Gauntlet 2.0 back at Avengers HQ.

The naked Time Stone seems to be surrounded by a force field of some kind, both here and in Avengers Infinity War; people who grab it don't really touch it. The Soul Stone places itself in your hand when you claim it. After what you pay for it, maybe it "knows" its owner? Maybe the sacrificed soul is inside the stone, and protects that person?
 
My only quibble is I would have liked them to call in Captain Marvel to do the unsnapping, so that her role in the movie is greater, and to give her a chance to be part of the team grieving Natasha, whom she seemed to have at least a bit of a rapport with in the teleconference scene. Then due to the snap, she is out of commission for the first part of the fight against Thanos's army, but gets to have a big hero moment bursting out of the ground.

Also, I wanted Hulk to be holding up the debris to protect people, and instead of looking panicked, he should have glowered and said something about how Thanos just made him angry. Then let him smash a bit, but do smart smashing.
 

Erekose

Adventurer
Note that most of the stones are in containers (The Tessaract, The Orb, The Scepter, Rocket's syringe) that are safe to touch, and all the raw stones are manipulated by machines when put into Tony's Infinity Gauntlet 2.0 back at Avengers HQ.

The naked Time Stone seems to be surrounded by a force field of some kind, both here and in Avengers Infinity War; people who grab it don't really touch it. The Soul Stone places itself in your hand when you claim it. After what you pay for it, maybe it "knows" its owner? Maybe the sacrificed soul is inside the stone, and protects that person?
Doesn't Tony pick-up The Tessaract with his hand and put it in the briefcase?
 

Bagpuss

Adventurer
But how would the time travel mechanism "know" which option to pick?
That's what I thought the anchor point, base plate they start on was for to make sure you get back to the right dimension. Since Steve and Tony jumped further into the past with just the suits, no base station, it seemed you don't need it to travel into the quantum realm and through time.

But yeah Steve taking the long way back doesn't make sense if they are actually visiting alternate dimensions... unless of course we are just seeing the dimension where Steve travelled the long way back, and not really the same as the one he left, even though there is a base station there (perhaps the Steve that left that dimension is dead in a ditch?). If there are multiple dimensions then pretty much any outcome is possible.

The movie has a load of improbable things, like all of Peter Paker's class being part of the 50% to disappear, or all the ladies lining up (erm Hope, weren't you at the van they are trying to get the glove to a second ago and maybe you should be fixing it as Scott was never the brains of your team) and massive plot holes, but you know what I don't care, loved it anyway.
 
Last edited:

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
Let me explain how the ending with Cap isn't a paradox.

You only split off a new timeline if you change what you know. So Loki escaping? New timeline. Sending Nebula into the future and then bringing your army? New timeline. Rocket stabs Jane with a syringe? Slightly new timeline.

But Captain America never knew who Peggy Carter married, and she dutifully kept it secret from the recently thawed Steve Rogers. So when he went back and reunited with her, that changed nothing. Thus, it's the same timeline.
Yes, Captain America staying can be explained without creating a new timeline, however...

You forgot Nebula killing the Nebula of the past, thereby ending her own existence(except it didn't somehow) new timeline. Killing Thanos off before he ever used the stones in Infinity War new timeline. Killing Thanos off before he ever killed Gamora(that should have brought her back since Thanos never sacrificed her) new timeline.

And let's not forget that the old Nebula didn't have any more Pym Particles to even bring Thanos into the future with, having used the one round trip worth of them that she she got from Nebula to get to the future in the first place.

Great movie, but some pretty sizable plot holes.
 

GreyLord

Adventurer
Yes, Captain America staying can be explained without creating a new timeline, however...

You forgot Nebula killing the Nebula of the past, thereby ending her own existence(except it didn't somehow) new timeline. Killing Thanos off before he ever used the stones in Infinity War new timeline. Killing Thanos off before he ever killed Gamora(that should have brought her back since Thanos never sacrificed her) new timeline.

And let's not forget that the old Nebula didn't have any more Pym Particles to even bring Thanos into the future with, having used the one round trip worth of them that she she got from Nebula to get to the future in the first place.

Great movie, but some pretty sizable plot holes.
That's right, I hadn't thought about that.

How DID Thanos follow?
 

Istbor

Explorer
That's right, I hadn't thought about that.

How DID Thanos follow?
True. It wasn't explained well. One could argue that being a super alien warlord allowed him to study the substance use his advanced tech and probable army of techs to engineer more. That would be my first guess. I don't know what the in cannon reason is though.
 

Erekose

Adventurer
Well the easy answer to all of the inconsistencies is that Tony restored everything back to its proper place when he clicked his fingers. We’ve no evidence this isn’t what happened. All we saw was that Thanos and his army disappeared.
 

Advertisement

Top