Bards: Arcane or Shadow?

[Howndawg]

After reading over the bard description in R&C and the description of the Shadow power source in W&M, it seems like Shadow would be a more natural fit for the bard than arcane. The bard deals with deception and trickery and that seems like Shadow's forte. Has it ever been confirmed that the bard will be arcane, or has it just been assumed? Anybody have any thoughts on the matter?

 

[MaelStorm]

Arcane, Divine or Primal? I don't see Shadow anywhere in the Bard entry, and I have R&C BTW.

 

[MaelStorm]

The bard deals with deception and trickery and that seems like Shadow's forte.

Illusion type spells.

 

[Nahat Anoj]

After reading over the bard description in R&C and the description of the Shadow power source in W&M, it seems like Shadow would be a more natural fit for the bard than arcane. The bard deals with deception and trickery and that seems like Shadow's forte. Has it ever been confirmed that the bard will be arcane, or has it just been assumed? Anybody have any thoughts on the matter?

On a post at the Paizo boards, Rodney Thompson said that when the Bard comes out, it will probably be an Arcane Leader. That's the most "confirmation" we have. Here's a link to the EN World post, which itself has a link to the original Paizo post.

IMO, I think both sources could make good illusions. I think Arcane should be better at creating images, while Shadow might be better at invisibility style things.

 

[Sir Brennen]

Shadow is more than just deception and trickery. It's manipulating the stuff of the Shadowfell itself. That's why Necromancers will probably have a Shadow power source.

Bards will most likely be Arcane based on various designer comments, though in my own 3.x game, I actually had spellcasters grouped into magical disciplines: Arcane, Divine and Nature (which affected DCs for Spellcraft checks and the like for something not of your magical discipline.) Bards were their own magical discipline - Art. In 4E terms, this would be a power source which draws directly from mortal creativity. I wish the 4E Bard went down a route like this rather than dipping back into the Arcane well.

 

[Howndawg]

Some very good answers. I think the bard could go either way, myself. If he is shadow, though, it would mean that shadow would be a definite for the PHBII.

 

[fuindordm]

Who decided that bards should be illusionists? That's one of the few things I really didn't like about 3E.

 

[KrazyHades]

Who decided that bards should be illusionists? That's one of the few things I really didn't like about 3E.

The thing is that illusion spells go with the feeling of bards as somewhat magical storytellers. A bard can make you see and hear and feel the tale they are presenting. I think that illusions fit well with this concept.

 

[fuindordm]

Ah yes... the Rankin-Bass interpretation of minstrelry.

 

[bganon]

I'd hate to have -all- Bards shoehorned into being emo shadow-lurking tricksters. Bards are supposed to be inspirational too, and I don't really get that flavor from Shadow.

I suppose the choice of "patron" could work similarly to the Warlock pact: Bards with a shadow patron killed the Beguiler and took her stuff, Bards with an astral patron would be most like the "classic" bard, Bards with a fey patron... I dunno, beastmaster or something?