D&D 5E Beholder hunting: nasty counter-tactics to Darkness?

[FormerlyHemlock]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned in this thread:

I don't think it's cheesey for Darkness to shut down beholder eyes because "harm you by looking at you" is kind of their thing. The fact that Darkness shuts them down is no more unthematic or unaesthetic than the fact that sunlight shuts down vampires, that mirrors/averted eyes shut down medusas, or that Silence shuts down wizards. If you had a 4th level version of Silence that was mobile it would be equally as terrifying to wizards as Darkness should be to beholders.

In both cases you either run away or learn to work around it. This thread is for brainstorming ways to work around it. The gimmicky play is a reward for players who use their brains instead of their d20s, but I don't want the gimmick to scale up to unlimited levels. Next time that will just mean "include other aberrations on a beholder ship who are melee-specialized" but for I want the beholders to work with what they've got, even though the PCs are no longer onscreen, so I can describe what the PCs find if they come back later to investigate.

 

[KarinsDad]

Actually they already do that, quite lot spells target "a creature in range you can see"

It's the same issue for every other spell caster too

Only for maybe 20% of range targeting spells. Most spells do not have this wording. If the foe does not have full cover, you can target him. I do not have the MM in front of me, but if Beholders have most or all of their spells with this limitation, it's fairly huge.

 

[Mirtek]

Only for maybe 20% of range targeting spells. Most spells do not have this wording. If the foe does not have full cover, you can target him. I do not have the MM in front of me, but if Beholders have most or all of their spells with this limitation, it's fairly huge.

Just did the check for the beholder vs. the equivalent spells in the PHB:

Rays 1 (Charm Person), 2 (Hold Person/Monster), 5 (Finger of Death), 6 (Telekinesis), 8 (Flesh to Stone), 9 (Disintigration), and 10 (Power Word Kill) emulate spells that all require being able to see the target

Rays 3 (Fear), 4 (Slow), 7 (Sleep) emulate spells that do not require being able to see the target.

So that's 7/10 that every other caster has the same issues with

 

[GX.Sigma]

Wait, I don't understand the problem. Beholders have an anti-magic field coming from their central eye (which is not random, and is active all the time). How are they defeated by a darkness spell?

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Wait, I don't understand the problem. Beholders have an anti-magic field coming from their central eye (which is not random, and is active all the time). How are they defeated by a darkness spell?

Because the anti-magic eye affects the beholder's own eye rays, as explicitly outlined in the MM entry. Anti-magic is therefore not available as a counter for Darkness: the cure is as bad as the disease.

 

[Celtavian]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned in this thread:

I don't think it's cheesey for Darkness to shut down beholder eyes because "harm you by looking at you" is kind of their thing. The fact that Darkness shuts them down is no more unthematic or unaesthetic than the fact that sunlight shuts down vampires, that mirrors/averted eyes shut down medusas, or that Silence shuts down wizards. If you had a 4th level version of Silence that was mobile it would be equally as terrifying to wizards as Darkness should be to beholders.

In both cases you either run away or learn to work around it. This thread is for brainstorming ways to work around it. The gimmicky play is a reward for players who use their brains instead of their d20s, but I don't want the gimmick to scale up to unlimited levels. Next time that will just mean "include other aberrations on a beholder ship who are melee-specialized" but for I want the beholders to work with what they've got, even though the PCs are no longer onscreen, so I can describe what the PCs find if they come back later to investigate.

I do think it's cheesy. In a game where a creature like a beholder is supposed to be this incredibly fearsome creature, it is pathetic that a common 2nd level spell a party can easily use tactically can turn a beholder encounter into a joke where they can do nothing.

Nowhere does it say darkness affects a beholder like sunlight affects a vampire. That comparison is false. Sunlight is pointed out as specifically affecting vampires and is traditional vampire lore. Darkness has never traditionally made beholders impotent. I do not recall an edition where beholders were essentially useless against darkness. So there is no traditional weakness against darkness comparable to a vampire's sunlight weakness.

This is just a mistake by the game designers that turned beholders into a joke creature using a common tactic available to multiple classes. In this case you're using darkness. You could easily use greater invisibility and have some class beat on the beholder with no fear of its eyes. It's a cheesy way to build a creature gracing the cover of the Monster Manual.

 

[Celtavian]

Just did the check for the beholder vs. the equivalent spells in the PHB:

Rays 1 (Charm Person), 2 (Hold Person/Monster), 5 (Finger of Death), 6 (Telekinesis), 8 (Flesh to Stone), 9 (Disintigration), and 10 (Power Word Kill) emulate spells that all require being able to see the target

Rays 3 (Fear), 4 (Slow), 7 (Sleep) emulate spells that do not require being able to see the target.

So that's 7/10 that every other caster has the same issues with

True. Every other caster has access to dispel magic or daylight which defeats darkness. Or alternate spells that don't require you target with seeing. The beholder does not have this option with any of its eye rays.

Now I guess warlocks are beholder bane. Warlocks with Devil Sight can now advertise their services as beholder killers. I can see the commercials now:

"Pesky beholder causing you problems? Call your local warlock with Devil Sight. He will exterminate that beholder with a casting of darkness and eldritch blast. The tried and true method of beholder extermination. All them eyes can't see in the dark making them useless, while the warlock unleash eldritch energies safely from a distance usually with heroic allies to handle any pesky guardians the beholder may have charmed. All this for a small price of 2,000 gold."

And there's the even more fun, "I rolled the telekinesis eye ray again? I already have all of them grappled with telekinesis. Son of a..."

 

[Celtavian]

I don't think Random Eye Rays are a problem. And it is easily fixable to just have them guess the location of their targets. Just say the target gets advantage on the saving throw.

You can do that. It should have been included in the text for situations where the target isn't visible.

I feel bad mostly for new DMs who will have to figure out how to handle beholders and lack of visibility since it isn't stated. Experienced DMs likely will handle it as you have outlined and probably won't follow the random eye ray rule as that makes beholders substantially weaker. Long time D&D DMs know what a beholder is and will play them properly. Not this odd new way of playing beholders some game designer decided on.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

"Pesky beholder causing you problems? Call your local warlock with Devil Sight. He will exterminate that beholder with a casting of darkness and eldritch blast. The tried and true method of beholder extermination. All them eyes can't see in the dark making them useless, while the warlock unleash eldritch energies safely from a distance usually with heroic allies to handle any pesky guardians the beholder may have charmed. All this for a small price of 2,000 gold."

So you're just going to give up and die? You won't even try to disintegrate the roof and fly away, for example? Or collapse the ceiling so he has to waste time tunneling through? Or recruit minions by regular intimidation so that the warlock becomes nothing more than a human with 14 arrows in his chest?

You give up too easily.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

And there's the even more fun, "I rolled the telekinesis eye ray again? I already have all of them grappled with telekinesis. Son of a..."

Reroll Duplicates.

If they are grappled with Telekinesis they are not going to be again.

Anyway the Random Eye rays are just an extension of the fact the Beholder could only use certain eye rays in a certain arc in the old editions.