Book of 9 Swords: One discipline Only?

[Kmart Kommando]

In my game, I limit initiators to only one discipline through playtest showing that otherwise they aren't balance in my game (maybe not in yours, but in mine). They are still balanced with the other classes in play even with only one discipline.

Then your other players aren't trying very hard. My swordsage couldn't keep up with most of the rest of the party, even with a broad array of abilities. The wizard/master transmogrifer was using the example straight out of the book and whooping up twice as much ass as my swordsage was. Though I do tend to roll crappy, well, all the time.
It was still casters > all, the way 3.5 intended.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Then your other players aren't trying very hard. My swordsage couldn't keep up with most of the rest of the party, even with a broad array of abilities. The wizard/master transmogrifer was using the example straight out of the book and whooping up twice as much ass as my swordsage was. Though I do tend to roll crappy, well, all the time.
It was still casters > all, the way 3.5 intended.

The Swordsage was doing obscene damage with Desert Wind modified to Cold damage, choosing the manoeuvres that gave him +damage to all attacks and then two-weapon fighting for tons of damage. Admittedly he can't make it through a big fight without using Adaptive Style, but with Adaptive Style, he was extremely powerful.

The other players were definitely trying--one of the other players is playing a rather-ridiculous Iajutsu Master, for instance, who does hundreds of damage before anyone can act (and with +20 Initiative, I really mean before anyone can act!).

 

[hong]

Not sure how that SS manages to be so powerful. They have medium BAB so they should hit less often compared to a regular tank or melee brute, and it also means fewer iterative attacks. Also, a lot of monsters at high levels tend to have energy resistance, although cold resist seems less common than fire resist.

Also, is he just full-attacking with the extra fire damage per attack? That means forgoing the Wis bonus to damage, since that only functions on strikes.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Not sure how that SS manages to be so powerful. They have medium BAB so they should hit less often compared to a regular tank or melee brute, and it also means fewer iterative attacks. Also, a lot of monsters at high levels tend to have energy resistance, although cold resist seems less common than fire resist.

Also, is he just full-attacking with the extra fire damage per attack? That means forgoing the Wis bonus to damage, since that only functions on strikes.

He gets ice all around him and then he has a feat that gives +4 to attack and damage while on ice--that takes care of the BAB difference between himself and the full BAB characters. Also, one of the other party members is a Ftr/Shou Disciple/Ninja who has even less to hit but has a simply massive number of attacks per round, but the Swordsage stays on par with the massive ice damage. Energy resistance puts a damper on it, but he usually does more than enough to penetrate that, particularly on a crit.

 

[Engilbrand]

Maybe I'm missing something, but the energy wouldn't be multiplied on a crit. Also, a lot of the maneuvers would require a swift or standard action. Realistically, he should have a lot of attacks where he can only make 1 attack.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Maybe I'm missing something, but the energy wouldn't be multiplied on a crit. Also, a lot of the maneuvers would require a swift or standard action. Realistically, he should have a lot of attacks where he can only make 1 attack.

He also had the Burst energy enhancement on his weapons. As to the other strikes, he used them grudgingly--the ones he liked best were the ones that gave him tons of extra energy damage per attack (usually Xd6+level)

 

[hong]

I think you need to put them up against more AC 40+ monsters, mang....

 

[Rystil Arden]

I think you need to put them up against more AC 40+ monsters, mang....

Did that--AC 41 Aspect of Mammon. The 16th-level Swordsage did fine, mostly thanks to a combination of the +4 to hit and damage on ice and the Marshal's Aura of + to hit. 12 + 9 Dex + 3 Marshal + 4 Feat + 4 GMW + 2 Flanking = +34 to Hit. I know they had one or two more sources that gave +3 (maybe Prayer is one?) because he still had +35 after the -2 for TWF. That meant he hit on a 6 with attack #Haste, #1, #1OH, and 11 on attack #2 and #2OH, and 16 on attack #3 and (I think he had #3OH as well). Mammon's Cold Resist 10 was annoying to him (he would have kicked ass even more if it wasn't around), but he usually did substantially more than 10 Cold Damage per hit, so it wasn't a dealbreaker.

 

[hong]

As I said though, he's giving up Wis bonus to damage if he goes for a full attack. There are no strikes that I'm aware of that involve full attacks, except for Time Stands Still (which is Diamond Mind).

And hey, you let him get the +4 on ice feat, and switch Desert Wind fire to cold....

 

[Rystil Arden]

As I said though, he's giving up Wis bonus to damage if he goes for a full attack. There are no strikes that I'm aware of that involve full attacks, except for Time Stands Still (which is Diamond Mind).

And hey, you let him get the +4 on ice feat, and switch Desert Wind fire to cold....

Yep, he gave up the Wis bonus to damage on most of his rounds (he was happy to keep it on the rounds he couldn't use his favourite manoeuvres, of course), but he didn't mind. As for changing the fire to cold, that seemed more a matter of flavour. I wouldn't have let him change it to sonic, for instance.

I'm sure that he could have been substantially more ridiculous if he had chosen a school other than Desert Wind, though, that didn't allow the energy resistance. I created as a test character a White Raven School-Only Warblade which broke my game in playtest, for instance, and an appropriately-optimised Concentration master using Concentration checks for damage (and later 2x Concentrations checks) is an absolute murderer at low levels.