D&D (2024) bring back the pig faced orcs for 6th edition, change up hobgoblins & is there a history of the design change

[wicked cool]

Not sure exactly sure when orcs were changed but I argue they should be changed back

why?
1) orcs have been becoming more and more human like and its made them less interesting plus like drow they are a future problem for an everchanging society
2) if not maybe a variant
3) the orc name is from "pig faced"

hobgoblin
1) hobgoblins need something . Over the years kobolds, gnolls, bugbears and even goblins have become more interesting. Kobolds became inventors and the design has greatly improved. Same with gnolls. hobgoblins have been dulled down (they are the military/armored slightly stronger goblin) and often get sort of lumped in with orcs (theres nothing that really jumps out about a hobgoblin)
2) I think they need a change-Maybe they are cannibals, maybe they have a unique spell/ability , give them a distinct appearance (I would make them more like the falmer of elder scrolls-scary)

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

1. On Orcs- oh no. That's a thread closer.

2. On Hobgoblins- I think the idea of being organized, fearsome martial warriors - similar to Roman Legions - has become much more prevalent, and is a great hook for them.

 

[ART!]

3) the orc name is from "pig faced"

To nitpick - because hey, it's what we do:

Origin

 

[DnD Warlord]

I like sub races I like the idea of BOTH fallen half elf with greenish grey skin AND pig faced pink with slight dark green highlights.
(I also like both draconian and dog like kobolds)

 

[Stormonu]

Orcs haven’t been pig-faced since before 2E. Actually, I think GW’s Warhammer (40K) miniatures redefined D&D’s look. And it’s a look I’m not really keen on going back to.

Hobgoblins have really been getting their own personality since 4E, and I like the “Roman legion” sort of direction they’ve acquired.

Orcs, however, seem to have been losing traction over the years in preference to the goblinoid races (hobgoblin, bugbear, goblin), and I’m not sure why - maybe the prevalence of World of Warcraft’s popularity? It seems to me they’ve been used less and less as adversaries over the last few years.

 

[not-so-newguy]

This is how I picture Orcs and it will always be how I will picture Orcs. It's a mook staple of... erm .... Jabba the Hutt.

Edited in order to defeat my arch-nemesis English Grammar.

 

[embee]

Not sure exactly sure when orcs were changed but I argue they should be changed back

why?
1) orcs have been becoming more and more human like and its made them less interesting plus like drow they are a future problem for an everchanging society
2) if not maybe a variant
3) the orc name is from "pig faced"

hobgoblin
1) hobgoblins need something . Over the years kobolds, gnolls, bugbears and even goblins have become more interesting. Kobolds became inventors and the design has greatly improved. Same with gnolls. hobgoblins have been dulled down (they are the military/armored slightly stronger goblin) and often get sort of lumped in with orcs (theres nothing that really jumps out about a hobgoblin)
2) I think they need a change-Maybe they are cannibals, maybe they have a unique spell/ability , give them a distinct appearance (I would make them more like the falmer of elder scrolls-scary)

Orcs: the name has nothing to do with pigs.

Hobgoblins: They are, in real-life lore, trickster house spirits. Not cannibals.

I don't think that either are becoming "less interesting" but rather that you find the current iteration of orcs and hobgoblins to be less interesting than you found prior iterations.

That said, you do you. If you want Gamorrean orcs, describe them as such. Your table, your world.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Orcs, however, seem to have been losing traction over the years in preference to the goblinoid races (hobgoblin, bugbear, goblin), and I’m not sure why - maybe the prevalence of World of Warcraft’s popularity? It seems to me they’ve been used less and less as adversaries over the last few years.

Yeah. In ye olden days, Orcs were THE enemy in D&D. Obviously, every table is different, etc., but just like "fireball" was the signature spell, orcs were the signature baddie. I don't know if it was Tolkien influence, or because of early modules like B2, or the zeitgeist, or what, but it was definitely a thing.

Now? Not so much. Probably because more people are interested in being orcs than fighting them, I guess.

 

[ART!]

I've always avoided using orcs at all. Even from my earliest days playing D&D (in the late '70s!!!), I felt like they belonged to Tolkien. I use goblins, ogres, kobolds, and everything else of that ilk instead. There's plenty to work with there.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

As per the recent UA, hobgoblins seem to be reverting to what they where before Tolkien turned them into GenericSoldiersOfEvil(TM).

Seems like an improvement to me.

“Oh,” cried Lizzie, “Laura, Laura,
You should not peep at goblin men.”
Lizzie cover’d up her eyes,
Cover’d close lest they should look;
Laura rear’d her glossy head,
And whisper’d like the restless brook:
“Look, Lizzie, look, Lizzie,
Down the glen tramp little men.
One hauls a basket,
One bears a plate,
One lugs a golden dish
Of many pounds weight.
How fair the vine must grow
Whose grapes are so luscious;
How warm the wind must blow
Through those fruit bushes.”
“No,” said Lizzie, “No, no, no;
Their offers should not charm us,
Their evil gifts would harm us.”
She thrust a dimpled finger
In each ear, shut eyes and ran:
Curious Laura chose to linger
Wondering at each merchant man.
One had a cat’s face,
One whisk’d a tail,
One tramp’d at a rat’s pace,
One crawl’d like a snail,
One like a wombat prowl’d obtuse and furry,
One like a ratel tumbled hurry skurry.