Cloistered clerics and coradine monks

[Fallenibilis]

Cloistered clerics get 2 skill points more a level then Archivists something i've always had a problem with.

 

[Empirate]

That tends not to be an issue, since Archivists have Int as a primary stat - they'll very likely more than make up the difference in skillpoints.
Besides, with spells such as Divine Insight, Wieldskill etc., who needs skillpoints? Not to mention Summon X.


EDIT: Dammit! I totally missed my 1000th post! Already at 1003...

 

[Ashtagon]

That tends not to be an issue, since Archivists have Int as a primary stat - they'll very likely more than make up the difference in skillpoints.
Besides, with spells such as Divine Insight, Wieldskill etc., who needs skillpoints? Not to mention Summon X.


EDIT: Dammit! I totally missed my 1000th post! Already at 1003...

Exactly this. Character class skill point availability is designed around certain assumptions about how high their Int scores will be pumped. That is why the wizard class is 2 + Ont points. They end up with a good number of skill points from their Int, which simply leaves them on a par with, say, a ranger.

 

[emanresu]

All divine spells, not domains, on top of domain abilities domains grant spells they may very well be on other lists including sorcerer/wizard list, even though they aren't on a cleric list you get them because they are in your domain. Your God makes them divine for your use.

confused (again) I thought Clerics were the only class that got the special ability granted by domain. I thought Archivist could select spells from all domians but did not get the special bonus granted by all domains, accordingly. Are you saying I am incoorect? That Archivist that picks spell or two from, lets say, the travel domian, that he gets the temporary freedom of movement ability, granted by the domian as well?

 

[Empirate]

Archivists can gain spells in their prayerbook, even if those spells are usually arcane, as long as the spells in question is in a domain. For example, an Archivist could walk up to a temple of Kossuth, buy a divine scroll of Fire Shield (granted as part of the Fire domain), and scribe it in his prayerbook. That's all emoplato meant, I believe.

Archivists don't gain any domain granted benefits or domain spell slots. For example, the abovementioned Archivist would not get a domain spell slot for casting Fire Shield - he'd have to prepare the spell in one of his regular slots. He'd also not get the ability to turn water creatures, as per the Fire domain granted power.

Note that some divine casting prestige classes grant bonus domains. If you don't have a domain prior to entering, you'd gain everything you need to properly make use of the domain. If you're an Archivist and enter, say, Contemplative, you do gain a domain spell slot for preparing the bonus domain's spells in, and you'd gain the bonus domain's granted power.

 

[emoplato]

confused (again) I thought Clerics were the only class that got the special ability granted by domain. I thought Archivist could select spells from all domians but did not get the special bonus granted by all domains, accordingly. Are you saying I am incoorect? That Archivist that picks spell or two from, lets say, the travel domian, that he gets the temporary freedom of movement ability, granted by the domian as well?

Archivists don't really get domain spells unless they are on another divine list. Domain spells have their own special slots in cleric casting, as such they could have spells from any list but still be considered divine but while not on a cleric's base one. Archivists don't have those slots so they can't select domains. The Cloistered Cleric is just a slightly more frail and more casting oriented variant of the cleric so yes they get all domain abilities and turn undead.

 

[Empirate]

I'm not sure I'm getting you, but I think you're wrong. A Cleric who has a spell as a domain spell can sure as hell scribe a scroll of that spell (after memorizing it, in his domain slot naturally). That scroll is then a divine spell scroll, which an Archivist can copy into his prayerbook. So yes, an Archivist can have easy access to e.g. Fire Shield as a divine spell.

 

[emoplato]

I'm not sure I'm getting you, but I think you're wrong. A Cleric who has a spell as a domain spell can sure as hell scribe a scroll of that spell (after memorizing it, in his domain slot naturally). That scroll is then a divine spell scroll, which an Archivist can copy into his prayerbook. So yes, an Archivist can have easy access to e.g. Fire Shield as a divine spell.

If he finds a cleric or organization that has done that, of course he could, but that is entirely in the DM's realm of control. Wizards of the Coast only says divine spells otherwise. He can't convert normally arcane spells into divine by himself.
Heroes of Horror Excerpt

 

[Empirate]

True enough, but probably not much of a hindrance in a pure CO discussion. I concur that Archivists are extremely dependent on what the DM chooses to drop in their laps, though. This can severely cramp their style, and would bar them from becoming the powerhouse many COers want to see them as in most campaigns, I believe.