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Converting prehistoric animals

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demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
Improved grab, swallow whole seem right to me. Bonus to Hide checks made underwater, and ranks in Move Silently.

Demiurge out.
 

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Shade

Monster Junkie
RavinRay said:
Here's a video of it's close relative Liopleurodon attacking, from Walking With Dinosaurs.
Thanks! Walking with Dinosaurs was on the other night, but I missed that part.

Hmm...the liopleurodon appeared in Dragon Magazine #318 as a Colossal 38-HD monster. I suppose we could just reverse-engineer it down to 17 HD and Gargantuan. Doing so would look like this...

Gargantuan Animal
Hit Dice: 17d8+170 (246 hp)
Initiative: +4
Speed: Swim 90 ft. (18 squares)
Armor Class: 21 (-4 size, +15 natural), touch 6, flat-footed 21
Base Attack/Grapple: +12/+38
Attack: Bite +22 melee (3d8+21/19-20)
Full Attack: Bite +22 melee (3d8+21/19-20)
Space/Reach: 20 ft./15 ft.
Special Attacks: Frenzy, improved grab, swallow whole
Special Qualities: Hold breath, keen scent, low-light vision
Saves: Fort +20, Ref +10, Will +8
Abilities: Str 38, Dex 10, Con 30, Int 2, Wis 16, Cha 13
Skills: Spot +23, Swim +22
Feats: Awesome Blow, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Critical (bite), Improved Initiative, Improved Natural Attack (bite), Power Attack
Environment: Any aquatic
Organization: Solitary or pair
Challenge Rating: 10
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: 18-34 HD (Gargantuan); 35-51 HD (Colossal)

Frenzy (Ex): If a kronosaurus is reduced to less than half its normal maximum hit points, it flies into a terrible rage of frenzied activity. During a frenzy, a kronosaurus gains a +4 bonus to its Armor Class and attack rolls. Its swim speed gains a +30 foot bonus, and if it makes a full attack action it gains an additional bite attack. The frenzy persists for 1 minute, after which the kronosaurus cannot enter a frenzy while it is fatigued.

Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, a kronosaurus must hit an opponent of up to one size smaller with its bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can try to swallow the foe the following round.

Swallow Whole (Ex): A kronosaurus can try to swallow a grabbed opponent of up to two sizes smaller by making a successful grapple check.

The swallowed creature takes 2d8+8 points of bludgeoning damage and 8 points of acid damage per round from the liopleurodon's gizzard. A swallowed creature can cut its way out by using a light slashing or piercing weapon to deal 45 points of damage to the gizzard (AC 20). Once the creature exits, muscular action closes the hole; another swallowed creature must cut its own way out.

A Gargantuan kronosaurus's gizzard can hold 2 Large, 8 Medium, 32 Small, or 128 Tiny or smaller opponents.

Hold Breath (Ex): A kronosaurus can hold its breath for a number of rounds equal to 8 times its Constitution score before it risks drowning.

Keen Scent (Ex): A kronosaurus can notice creatures by scent in a 180-foot radius, and it can sense blood in the water at ranges of up to a mile.

Skills: A kronosaurus has a +8 racial bonus on any Swim check to perform a special action or avoid a hazard. It can always choose to take 10 on a Swim check, evne if distracted or endangered. It can use the run action while swimming, provided it swims in a straight line.

(Note that I did not modify the swallow whole damage, amount needed to escape, or AC of interior).


Of course, if you dino-experts think other changes should be made, I'm all for it.
 

demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
Looks about right to me.

Since plesiosaurs (so far as we know) didn't give live birth like icthyosaurs, I think we should give ol' Kronosaurus a 5ft land speed, so it can drag itself onto the shore to lay eggs.

Demiurge out.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Added to Homebrews (including land speed).

Suggestions for swallow whole damage and amount needed to cut out? I believe the interior AC is 17 (10 + 1/2 natural armor).
 

demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
The bonus damage should be equal to its Str bonus, so 14. The acid seems fine. Might want to reduce the gizzard hps from 45 to 35 or 30 (purple worms have 25 and are also Gargantuan, but this strikes me as somewhat harder to bust out of. More muscle mass).

Demiurge out.
 



Shade

Monster Junkie
Utahraptor
Climate/Terrain: Any tropical
Frequency: Rare
Org: Pack
Activity Cycle: Any
Diet: Carnivor
Int: Animal (1)
Treasure: Nil
Align: Neutral
# App: 5-20 adults
AC: 5
Movement: 19
HD: 7+3
THAC0: 13
# Attacks: 5
Dmg/Att: 1-6/1-6/2-8/2-8/1-10
SA: Jump, grasping claws
SD: Coloration
MR: Standard
Size: L (20' long)
Morale: Fearless (19)
XP Value: 975

The utahraptor is a carnivorous dinosaur related to the deinonychus, only it is much larger. The utahraptor is 20' long, stands 15' high, and weighs around 1,500 lbs. It stands upright on two stout legs, with its tail held stiffly out behind for balance, and has powerful "arms" with 10" claws. The raptor also has a 12"-long curved sickle claw on each foot; a horrible weapon used for gutting large prey. Their brown and green coloration blends well with trees in the forests.

Combat: Utahraptors attack with their arms first, clawing at the target in hopes of getting a firm grasp. If both claw attack succeed, the next two attacks (the sickle-clawed feet) are at +2 attack rolls. The final attack is with the creature's powerful jaws. One weakness of the raptor is its multiple attacks can be used only against a single target. Utahraptors are quick and agile and can leap at prey out of ambush; the leap is considered a charge, giving the raptor a +2 to attack rolls the first round.

The raptor's coloring allows them to hide well in foliage. If hiding in ambush, the raptors are 75% likely to be unseen (effectively invisible) adn can be located only by magic. They are able to leap 15' high from a standing start; at least 40' if running. They can leap 25' high and 50' forward and can drop down 25' without damage.

Utahraptors are intelligent for dinosaurs, but still rather stupid. This makes them utterly fearless. They do not check morale unless all adults in the pack are slain (the morale rating is for young and hatchling raptors). Utahraptors are genetically driven to attack creatures much larger than themselves and are immune to magical fear.

Habitat/Society: Utahraptors live in packs, much like lions. However, the leader is the largest female, not a male. The raptors are cooperative animals, coordinating hunts to set up cunning ambushes. Each pack has a clearly defined territory, which may expand as more food is needed when the pack increases in number. The raptors prefer dense forests and brush habitat. A pack is roughly divided between males and females. There are also plenty of young, not fully grown (equal to deinonychus from the Monstrous Manual tome). The pack includes a number of these young equal to 150% of the adults. There are also several hatchlings, equal in number to 200% of the adults; these have 1-4 hp and a damage of 1/1-2/1-2/1-4. Adult raptors become enraged if their young or eggs are threatened, and they gain a +1 to attack and damage rolls when fighting these intruders.

Ecology: Utahraptors are pure carnivores. They attack prey of any size and do not hesitate to tackle creatures much larger than themselves. They are on top of the food chain and have no enemies save for other utahraptor packs.

From Dungeon Magazine #54 (1995).
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utahraptor

My gut reaction was "aren't these just megaraptors", but apparently megaraptors aren't actually dromaeosaurs, but are more closely related to allosaurus.

So, dino-experts, should we convert this one to right the wrongs of the Monster Manual? ;)
 

demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
Yeah, real "megaraptors" aren't dromeosaurs. We could convert them for the thoroughness, but the stats would look very similar indeed.

Demiurge out.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Here's the megaraptor. What should we change?

Megaraptor
Large Animal
Hit Dice: 8d8+43 (79 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 60 ft. (12 squares)
Armor Class: 17 (–1 size, +2 Dex, +6 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 15
Base Attack/Grapple: +6/+15
Attack: Talons +10 melee (2d6+5)
Full Attack: Talons +10 melee (2d6+5) and 2 foreclaws +5 melee (1d4+2) and bite +5 melee (1d8+2)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Pounce
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +10, Ref +8, Will +4
Abilities: Str 21, Dex 15, Con 21, Int 2, Wis 15, Cha 10
Skills: Hide +9, Jump +27, Listen +12, Spot +12, Survival +12
Feats: Run, Toughness, Track
Environment: Warm forests
Organization: Solitary, pair, or pack (3–6)
Challenge Rating: 6
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: 9–16 HD (Huge); 17–24 HD (Gargantuan)
Level Adjustment: --

This creature is a larger version of the deinonychus, standing about 12 feet tall with a total length of 24 feet. It has the same appearance, habits, and abilities of the smaller version.

Combat

Pounce (Ex): If a megaraptor charges, it can make a full attack.

Skills: A megaraptor has a +8 racial bonus on Hide, Jump, Listen, Spot, and Survival checks.
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Well, we could drop the HD back to 7 for a start, though since these look to be Huge, maybe they should actually have more HD. Also, I think they should be immune to fear, as indicated here.
Utahraptors are intelligent for dinosaurs, but still rather stupid. This makes them utterly fearless. They do not check morale unless all adults in the pack are slain (the morale rating is for young and hatchling raptors). Utahraptors are genetically driven to attack creatures much larger than themselves and are immune to magical fear.
 

Shade

Monster Junkie
Wikipedia states that it is "Up to 6.5 m (21 ft) long, 2 m (6.6 ft) tall, and 700 kg (1,500 lb) in weight, Utahraptor would have been a formidable predator."

That could put in either Large or Huge size category, depending on which portion you which to focus.

If we went with Large, and allowed advancement to Huge, that would cover the next two size categories for the "raptor tree".

Thoughts?
 

demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
Keep it Large. Ironically, the dinosaur that Megaraptor really is (rather than the raptor), should be Huge.

...oh, WoTC...

Demiurge out.
 


Shade

Monster Junkie
Rather than just copying the megaraptor's stats, let's try advancing a deinonychus to Large...

Large Animal
Hit Dice: 7d8+42 (73 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 60 ft. (12 squares)
Armor Class: 17 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +7 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 16
Base Attack/Grapple: +5/+17
Attack: Talons +7 melee (2d6+8)
Full Attack: Talons +7 melee (2d6+8) and 2 foreclaws +2 melee (1d4+4) and bite +2 melee (2d6+4)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Pounce
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +12, Ref +6, Will +3
Abilities: Str 27, Dex 13, Con 23, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 10
Skills: Hide +6, Jump +30, Listen +10, Spot +10, Survival +10
Feats: Run, Track, 1 more
Environment: Warm forests
Organization: Solitary, pair, or pack (3–6)
Challenge Rating: 5
Treasure: None
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: x
Level Adjustment: -

Pounce (Ex): If a utahraptor charges, it can make a full attack.

Skills: A utahraptor has a +8 racial bonus on Hide, Jump, Listen, Spot, and Survival checks.


Does that look OK, or are the megaraptor stats closer to how you'd envision the utahraptor?
 

RavinRay

Explorer
Let's compare the megaraptor to the advanced deinonychus:
  • hp: mega- slightly higher
  • Str, Dex, Con: mega- has higher Dex but lower Str and Con
  • Talons, claw, bite: deino- slightly higher
The advanced deino- packs slightly more punch for a loss of one HD compared to the mega-. I think I'll go for the former.
 


demiurge1138

Inventor of Super-Toast
Multiattack for the third feat.

And capping advancement at Huge makes D&D sense, if not paleontological sense. So I say do it.

Demiurge out.
 


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