D&D General D&D without resource management

[Reynard]

The spellcasting thread got me thinking about what D&D might look like if it did not rely on daily resource management, or even any resource management at all.

Of course the biggest change would come to casters. I think the best solution would be to go to a "casting check" system. Personally I would not set DCs to particular spells, but instead let caster make a check to find out how much magical energy they can gather that turn, and then decide whether to use it immediately, or keep gathering next turn to be able to use bigger effects or more powerful spells. It would require a totally different system for casting and using spells, but that would not necessarily be a bad thing.

You could do something similar with martial abilities, gathering instead "advantage" or something that enables maneuvers and abilities that otherwise would have been per x-rest. This is kind of the default for fighting in inspirational media, from anime to pro-wrestling, so it shouldn't be that hard to implement.

The one that I am not sure of is hit points. "Wound levels" are usually just hit points with extra steps, and almost always come with a death spiral built in. You could do something like consequences, but that does not feel very D&D to me.

Anyway, I am curious what other folks think D&D without resource management -- especially rest based resource management -- would look like, and still "be D&D."

 

[billd91]

No, it wouldn't be D&D. It would be a different game. Might still be a fantasy RPG, but not D&D.

 

[Reynard]

No, it wouldn't be D&D. It would be a different game. Might still be a fantasy RPG, but not D&D.

Just for clarity, does that mean you think daily resource management is a fundamental aspect of D&D being D&D? And if so, which resources? Hit points and spell points, certainly, but rations? Arrows?

Note that I am not being argumentative. I am honestly curious what you think.

 

[aco175]

I guess without 1/day or 1/rest abilities there would only be basic attacks and cantrips. It would take a lot of the fantastic out of the game.

 

[Reynard]

I guess without 1/day or 1/rest abilities there would only be basic attacks and cantrips. It would take a lot of the fantastic out of the game.

I thought I made it pretty clear in the OP that there would be different ways of doing extra special things like spells and maneuvers.

 

[nogray]

On the hit points issue, something like Mutants and Masterminds with its Toughness/Damage save might be worth looking into. I don't know how well it would fit what you are looking for, though. You aren't tracking a resource, then, but you are tracking a potential cumulative penalty to further damage saves.

For limited power usage, 13th Age has something where fighters have abilities that only trigger/can be used on even-roll hits or numbers above 15 or when the escalation die is above a certain value or other such conditions.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

I absolutely despise resource management, so yeah:

You could divide more spells into Rituals, for starter, making them at will but requiring time (and a skill check, maybe? ala 4e).

To cast a spell you make a flat Int/Wis/Cha check against a DC set like 10+ spell level, if you succeed you cast the spell, if not you cant try spell from that level until a short rest (long rest for 6th + level ?)

HD recuperation could a set amount per rest, like (average HD amount + con) x prof.

Rage could just be a Reckless attack stance, you have advantage on attacks + damage + various effect as long a you maintain the stance, but creatures have advantage against you.

Ki could be changed to stances that unlock special Bonus Actions for monks, once per turn.

HP could be changed to various Conditions, Wounded and Dying would be one of them. Like a goblin attack could Daze, Impair, Poison, Slow, Prone whatever instead of doing damage. When you are hit you make a CON check to avoid the damaging condition. A dragon breath could simply save-or-die.

 

[Reynard]

On the hit points issue, something like Mutants and Masterminds with its Toughness/Damage save might be worth looking into. I don't know how well it would fit what you are looking for, though. You aren't tracking a resource, then, but you are tracking a potential cumulative penalty to further damage saves.

The M&M system works pretty well for its genre, but I have never tried it with a more D&D-like fantasy action adventure.

For limited power usage, 13th Age has something where fighters have abilities that only trigger/can be used on even-roll hits or numbers above 15 or when the escalation die is above a certain value or other such conditions.

That is interesting. Sounds arbitrary, but that may be based on you just giving a thumbnail. The idea that you have a resource that is "limited" by rare dice outcomes seems like it might work, but I can see that getting frustrating for players with cold dice.

 

[Krachek]

Actually you can play a party compose of all Rogue (without the arcane trickster) and have a ressourceless experience. Aside of hit points of course. It will be DnD.

 

[Reynard]

Actually you can play a party compose of all Rogue (without the arcane trickster) and have a ressourceless experience. Aside of hit points of course. It will be DnD.

That is an interesting thought. Rogues gain their special abilities based on circumstances rather than a resource pool. You could design other classses that work similarly: a battlemaster fighter that can use maneuvers when they have advantage on a target or a barbarian that rages based upon having taken some amount of damage.

 

[TwoSix]

I think you can move from a daily or encounter based refresh of powers and still kind of feel like D&D. Use some kind of combo point, or cascading level of conditions, to enable martial abilities. ("Use this ability to inflict condition A. Use this different ability on a target with condition A to do more damage and inflict condition B.")

For casters, you could use a treasure-based system (convert gold into material components into spells, spells limited by material components). For either type, you could also use a level-based system (each level, you gain a certain amount of narrative currency to spend on effects. Sort of like the 3e system for making magic items, but your level is based on XP earned, not XP accumulated.)

I think moving away from HP, and making combat win/loss based on escalating conditions, would tilt the game away from feeling like D&D. That's just a gut feeling, but hit points feel like a sacred cow for D&D-like games.

 

[nogray]

That is interesting. Sounds arbitrary, but that may be based on you just giving a thumbnail. The idea that you have a resource that is "limited" by rare dice outcomes seems like it might work, but I can see that getting frustrating for players with cold dice.

Yeah. Part of the character build is spreading the triggers out so you have something you can do on various rolls. Also, if I recall correctly, a half-elf (?) can treat their d20 roll as if it were one less than its actual value, tweaking the "natural" roll scored. Choosing to possibly lower your to-hit by one (risking a miss) for the opportunity to trigger a certain maneuver always seemed like it would be interesting game play.

 

[billd91]

Just for clarity, does that mean you think daily resource management is a fundamental aspect of D&D being D&D? And if so, which resources? Hit points and spell points, certainly, but rations? Arrows?

Note that I am not being argumentative. I am honestly curious what you think.

Yes, some element of resource management is core to the D&D experience - mainly hit points and magic resources whether spells, potions, or charges of wands.
Rations and arrows are less iconic, but the game has always pretty much included them or allowed DMs to hand wave them, so any game that completely glosses over it would be losing a potential portion of the D&D experience and drifting over toward the "Not D&D" end of the "How D&D is it" spectrum.

 

[aco175]

I thought I made it pretty clear in the OP that there would be different ways of doing extra special things like spells and maneuvers.

I thought you wanted replies to the point of it still looking like D&D. Your jumping on my post does not sound like you are curious to what others think.

 

[Vaalingrade]

No, it wouldn't be D&D. It would be a different game. Might still be a fantasy RPG, but not D&D.

IT would still be D&D, just a new, better D&D.

 

[Reynard]

I thought you wanted replies to the point of it still looking like D&D. Your jumping on my post does not sound like you are curious to what others think.

Your post basically said it couldn't be done. I disagree.

 

[the Jester]

Just for clarity, does that mean you think daily resource management is a fundamental aspect of D&D being D&D? And if so, which resources? Hit points and spell points, certainly, but rations? Arrows?

I think it is. Hps, spell slots/points, rations, ammunition, all of it- attrition is a fundamental part of the game (for me).

 

[Celebrim]

Aside from the actual social role-playing part, RPGs are primarily inventory management simulators.

 

[Clint_L]

I've mentioned this elsewhere, but when I want to run a session with no resource management, I work a game of Dread into the campaign. I just change the stakes so that it isn't quite as deadly as a normal game of Dread (or more deadly, if it's a session 0). Then all we have to manage is a stack of Jenga blocks.

 

[Reynard]

Aside from the actual social role-playing part, RPGs are primarily inventory management simulators.

I don't think that assertion stands up to much scrutiny.