D&D 5E Don't Throw 5e Away Because of Hasbro

[ngenius]

How I see the three popular 5e non-WoTC products.

Level Up Advanced 5e - D&D 5e Enhanced
(with improvements made over the base game like AD&D2e over AD&D sort of, hence several changes from 5e this, its own SRD in place of SRD5.1).

Fateforge 5e - D&D 5e Beautified
(the original 5e rules just presented more artistically with a few minor embellishments, hence, most terminology is same as SRD5 .1)

Core Fantasy 5e (Tales of the Valiant) - D&D 5e Revised
(mostly terms changed to move away from WoTC OGL but overall engine remains SRD5.1 with several revisions like Spell Levels replaced so may need a Core Fantasy SRD like Level Up has).

 

[UngeheuerLich]

No, seriously, I live under a rock.

Maybe you shoud adjust your globe so the country you live in is on top...

 

[Remathilis]

Part of the reason that people don't move from 5e is familiarity and sunk cost. That is, people play D&D because that's what they are familiar with, they learned, and they own. Inertia is a powerful force to overcome in consumers minds. They stick with known brands because they know them. It's why people drink mass production domestic beer instead of finding all manner of good craft beers available. Craft beer requires knowledge or exposure to appreciate, Bud Light is everywhere.

Unfortunately, that is a problem everywhere. People use the known brands even when other smaller ones are better. People shop at Walmart rather than local stores. They eat at McDonald's rather than Mom and Pop restaurants. They use Windows and Office on their PCs and iPhones for their phones. And they play D&D over some Kickstarter that requires them to learn a whole new set of rules again.

 

[Dire Bare]

How I see the three popular 5e non-WoTC products.

Level Up Advanced 5e - D&D 5e Enhanced
(with improvements made over the base game like AD&D2e over AD&D sort of, hence several changes from 5e this, its own SRD in place of SRD5.1).

Fateforge 5e - D&D 5e Beautified
(the original 5e rules just presented more artistically with a few minor embellishments, hence, most terminology is same as SRD5 .1)

Core Fantasy 5e (Tales of the Valiant) - D&D 5e Revised
(mostly terms changed to move away from WoTC OGL but overall engine remains SRD5.1 with several revisions like Spell Levels replaced so may need a Core Fantasy SRD like Level Up has).

I get a kick on how you refer to Fateforge, "D&D 5E Beautified"!

Those books ARE beautiful! The artwork, design, and layout is breathtaking.

 

[SlyFlourish]

Mike, I hope that 5e manages to break away from WotC and Hasboro. There is so much great content being made out there, and good people like you are making great products for the system. But I think the anger at WotC/Hasboro has made people look elsewhere for game and game systems. I have heard an awful lot of whistling past the graveyard after Ben Rigg's piece last week from people who make their money off of 5e, and being WotC-adjacent. You might want to think about making stuff that is system agnostic, or start working in a different system (there are so many!) Your awesome DM advice is useful no matter what game people play. I wish you only the best, my man. None of this is your fault.

My whole drive in this isn't because I want to make money selling 5e products. My biggest sellers are system agnostic.

But I really love 5e. I think it's a great system and I think it has tons of potential. I learn new things about it every week.

As I said in the original post, I think it's totally fine if you don't dig 5e and want to find another system. I also think it's totally fine if you love and are happy with WOTC's D&D 5e.

I think it's wasting an incredibly valuable system to throw away 5e because you're not happy with Hasbro and WOTC. It isn't theirs anymore. It's ours. All we have to do is look at Level Up Advanced 5e and see that.

This has nothing to do with me wanting to make money publishing 5e stuff and everything to do with me thinking it's a great system best not thrown away because of some corporate BS.

 

[Retreater]

As I said in the original post, I think it's totally fine if you don't dig 5e and want to find another system. I also think it's totally fine if you love and are happy with WOTC's D&D 5e.

I've had a lot of difficulty with 5e. The one time I tried to incorporate Level Up into an existing game, the magic item economy threw off everything (going from OAR's Isle of Dread to NG's Necropolis). Maybe if I start from the beginning with Level Up without using gold rewards from a TSR-era adventure, things will be more balanced.
The challenge system for 5e is completely off to me, and makes it impossible to plan encounters. I haven't tried Monstrous Menagerie or Flee Mortals yet, so perhaps those will help. I also haven't tried the Lazy GM's encounter guidelines.
Does anyone know if the Lazy GM's encounter guidelines work with Monstrous Menagerie and/or Flee Mortals, or should I stick with the methods used in those books?

 

[GothmogIV]

that is certainly one way to interpret the near-universal ‘you are wrong, Ben’ replies. I’d instead say they are probably correct and the sky is not falling

Hope for the best!

 

[GothmogIV]

My whole drive in this isn't because I want to make money selling 5e products. My biggest sellers are system agnostic.

But I really love 5e. I think it's a great system and I think it has tons of potential. I learn new things about it every week.

As I said in the original post, I think it's totally fine if you don't dig 5e and want to find another system. I also think it's totally fine if you love and are happy with WOTC's D&D 5e.

I think it's wasting an incredibly valuable system to throw away 5e because you're not happy with Hasbro and WOTC. It isn't theirs anymore. It's ours. All we have to do is look at Level Up Advanced 5e and see that.

This has nothing to do with me wanting to make money publishing 5e stuff and everything to do with me thinking it's a great system best not thrown away because of some corporate BS.

Mike, I hope you didn't take my comments as any kind of attack or criticism. I am a huge fan, and I would never do you like that. Keep on being awesome!

 

[Parmandur]

My whole drive in this isn't because I want to make money selling 5e products. My biggest sellers are system agnostic.

But I really love 5e. I think it's a great system and I think it has tons of potential. I learn new things about it every week.

As I said in the original post, I think it's totally fine if you don't dig 5e and want to find another system. I also think it's totally fine if you love and are happy with WOTC's D&D 5e.

I think it's wasting an incredibly valuable system to throw away 5e because you're not happy with Hasbro and WOTC. It isn't theirs anymore. It's ours. All we have to do is look at Level Up Advanced 5e and see that.

This has nothing to do with me wanting to make money publishing 5e stuff and everything to do with me thinking it's a great system best not thrown away because of some corporate BS.

I wouldn't lose any sleep over it: D&D is still selling like gangbusters, corporate shenanigans juat don't have that kind of impact.

 

[Malmuria]

I think it's wasting an incredibly valuable system to throw away 5e because you're not happy with Hasbro and WOTC.

So you are talking about the section of people that love 5e but that don’t want to play it anymore—even if they are just using already-purchased books—because of their dislike for Hasbro? Again, maybe I’m just out of touch but how many people are taking that exact stand? Sure, some people may decide against buying any new hasbro products, but how many people with a 2014 phb laying around will refuse to play a game they love because of what Hasbro did in 2023?

I agree that if you like 5e, and want new content for it without supporting Hasbro, you have plenty of 3p options