Draw Steel News

[Ruin Explorer]

From what little I have seen, It's a crunchier and more tactical Daggerheart. You roll 2d10 (+ ability) and your result falls into one of three categories, depending on how well you rolled (<= 11, 12 - 16, >= 17)

I mean, by that logic, you could say Draw Steel! was a crunchier and more tactical D&D 5E, because you roll 1d20 and the ability typically falls into one of two categories, depending on how well you rolled.

In reality, DH and Draw Steel! are very different systems with different ideas, focuses, concerns and approaches. They and 5E are all "heroic fantasy" RPGs and all influenced by 4E to some extent but that extent varies wildly and how they interpret and value "heroic fantasy" does too.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Everyone is running away from the D20, huh?

I am curious how much crunchier Draw Steel is. Because 5e is close to the top for me these days, Pathfinder 2 was too much. So Draw Steel falls on the wrong side for me, but it might still be interesting to me.

I would say Draw Steel is similar to 5E in crunch, overall - which is pared down significantly from 4E, which inspired it. Two things worth noting though:

1) Draw Steel! has 10 levels, not 20, and L1 is probably the equivalent of L3 in D&D, in terms of what you can do and how many abilities you have and so on.

2) Combat is very much designed to be played out on a grid-based map, not TotM, which isn't going to work for everyone.

 

[mamba]

That isn't particularly like DH at all, except you roll a pair of dice instead of a single d20.

and you have varying levels of success / failure, not just fail or succeed, like D&D

 

[mamba]

I mean, by that logic, you could say Draw Steel! was a crunchier and more tactical D&D 5E, because you roll 1d20 and the ability typically falls into one of two categories, depending on how well you rolled.

rolling 2 dice gives you a curve where the extremes are not as likely, like DH. Depending on your roll it is not just success or failure (like D&D) but varying degrees (like DH)

Not sure DS is crunchier than 5e, I expect it to be more tactical though

In reality, DH and Draw Steel! are very different systems with different ideas, focuses, concerns and approaches

sure, I just consider the similarity to 4e overblown. It has some of the same goals, but it is not a variation of 4e

 

[Reynard]

and you have varying levels of success / failure, not just fail or succeed, like D&D

But DH does NOT give you varying degrees of success. Success is binary, but the narrative tone of the outcome of the action is variable (also binary). It's actually an important distinction because otherwise GMs would too often go against the explicit principal of not undermining PC success with fear.

 

[mamba]

But DH does NOT give you varying degrees of success.

sure it does, complete failure, fail with hope, succeed with fear, full success, or whatever it calls them

4 levels, not 2 like D&D. DS in turn has 3, but is more descriptive about them, not narrative

 

[Reynard]

sure it does, complete failure, fail with luck, succeed with fear, full success, or whatever it calls them

4 levels, not 2 like D&D. DS in turn has 3

You ignored everything a wrote past the quoted part.

 

[mamba]

You ignored everything a wrote past the quoted part.

no, I disagreed with it

DH has four tiers of success / failure, not two like D&D. Saying success is still binary because either you fail or you succeed, there just are additional consequences is just semantics. There still are four tiers, DS in comparison has three, so also tiered, and not like D&D

 

[Reynard]

no, I disagreed with it

DH has four tiers of success / failure, not two like D&D. Saying success is still binary because either you fail or you succeed, there just are additional consequences is just semantics.

No, it isn't. Read the book.

 

[gnarlygninja]

I almost understand rewarding Patrons more, but we've gotten nothing for months now. I have a feeling I'll like A LOT of this game, but I'm really, really, really, turned off by their treatment of backers who gave them millions of dollars. Millions. They basically gave us the finger.

I am a backer and this attitude is frankly bizarre to me. I'm getting exactly what I was promised when I backed, which is not really what I would consider being given the finger.