Eternals (Spoilers)

Ryujin

Legend
That was a fait accompli they didn't need to consider.
I disagree. If the argument is that 94% of their remembered lives have been in combat, with only 6% being in relative peacetime, then the type of leader that they are familiar with from that 94% has a great deal of bearing on how they would move forward.
 

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billd91

Hobbit on Quest (he/him)
And there, we have to stop for a second. Thanos claims to be a Titan. Unless there's adoption involved, that means Eros is also a Titan. That implies that the Titans are Eternals, but not under Arishem's rule. Interesting that Arishem would not stop one of his own creations from eliminating half the population he needs to birth new Celestials, isn't it?
And in the comics, Thanos is the son of an Eternal (though with Deviant Syndrome) and the Titans were a colony of Eternals.
 

FitzTheRuke

Legend
I liked it more than I expected to. I don't feel that the characters were interesting enough. (I mean, my favorite characters after watching it were Gilgamesh and Kingo's Valet - I don't think that should be the takeaway). Also, their powers were both weirdly unique-to-them and yet all the same, making them shockingly forgettable/interchangeable for such a diverse cast.

But it was a lot more watchable than I expected after all the negativity I've heard.
 

Edit: and we're meant to think that this group that is struggling to take on 1-3 deviants midway through the movie is the same group that killed alllll of the deviants as of 400 years ago.

It was five Deviants total in the main jungle fight. Also, look at how out of shape professional athletes can get with just a year or two away from their sport. Now think about these Eternals not having to fight anything for over 400 years. They may not have been physically out of shape because their synthetic bodies don't do that, but their mental skills and fighting skills and teamwork skills turned to mush in that time. And also, when they finally get back together to deal with the thawed out Deviants, they have to do it without the one who was their leader for 7000 years. And with a traitor trying to screw them over.
 

Tonguez

A suffusion of yellow
My main problem was that basically Arishem and Tiamut came across as discount Galactus, with the Eternals filling in for both the Silver Surfer and the Fantastic Four. And it seems really weird for Marvel to be doing a discount Galactus story.
To be fair the Celestials are discount Galactus, nobody would dispute that :)

Theyre both super cosmic beings from before their respective big bangs, but Galactus is the Devourer of Worlds whereas Arishem mere judges them. As to why Marvel did it, I suspect it was because Inhumans was a flop and the Celestials had already been seeded
 


It was five Deviants total in the main jungle fight. Also, look at how out of shape professional athletes can get with just a year or two away from their sport. Now think about these Eternals not having to fight anything for over 400 years. They may not have been physically out of shape because their synthetic bodies don't do that, but their mental skills and fighting skills and teamwork skills turned to mush in that time. And also, when they finally get back together to deal with the thawed out Deviants, they have to do it without the one who was their leader for 7000 years. And with a traitor trying to screw them over.
That is an explanation, sure. But it's not well supported by the movie. Based on the movie they walked off their spaceship at apparently peak fighting capability despite "never" fighting these deviants before. Which do you think is worse, coming back to fight something you've fought for thousands of years, or fighting something for the first time?

In fairness though, the overall scope and extent of the fighting they had to do over those thousands of years wasn't ever really established. Was it a few deviants a week, a decade, a millennium? It may be that the Eternals are less a crack team of hardened warriors and more like reservists in the national guard, called up for emergencies and some occasional training exercises but otherwise doing something else with their time.

Ultimately, it was one of those things where I kept asking myself, even during the movie, "How powerful are these characters supposed to be?"

TBH, I still don't know the answer, so the best I can come up with is "as arbitrarily strong or weak as the plot requires them to be."
 


Janx

Hero
Now I would buy that argument, if the original leader wasn't the party's healer.
that and they had 400 years to contemplate.

What kind of shallow person doesn't reconsider their philosophies given 400 years of downtime?

Phaistos did. Heck, why isn't he in charge?
 


So basically like nearly every other superhero/villain ever?
Sure..ish. The level of arbitrariness for superhero power level is a gradient.

It goes from "Power level doesn't change much and/or such changes are well justified...to...Power levels fluctuate significantly with little or no explanation"

In this movie, it felt to me like the latter.

Ikaris has deadly eyebeams..except sometimes they aren't that deadly. Some of the characters seem like they're noncombatants.. except that they shrug off deadly eyebeams, or solo the "strongest" member of the team. A characters gets stabbed and we're meant to think that means anything, except that it doesn't seem to, yet Mr. Shrugsoffeyebeams hits Stabbyperson in the head with a rock and Stabbyperson is out of the fight.

No explanation, no justification, no red or yellow kryptonite or anything. Just a "yeah that all happened. Trust us this really is coherent. We promise."
 

Ryujin

Legend
that and they had 400 years to contemplate.

What kind of shallow person doesn't reconsider their philosophies given 400 years of downtime?

Phaistos did. Heck, why isn't he in charge?
People who live a million years? "The older we get, the more we become ourselves." - Alan Andrews

No one ever puts the tech in charge. It's always the guy who doesn't understand tech, who becomes the manager.
 


Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
My main problem was that basically Arishem and Tiamut came across as discount Galactus, with the Eternals filling in for both the Silver Surfer and the Fantastic Four. And it seems really weird for Marvel to be doing a discount Galactus story.
I was talking to a friend today that ran a comic book store up until last year. He was telling me that this story was from the comics and that Galactus's real purpose was as a natural predator who went around consuming worlds with baby Celestials in them in order to cull the herd.
 


Tonguez

A suffusion of yellow
I was talking to a friend today that ran a comic book store up until last year. He was telling me that this story was from the comics and that Galactus's real purpose was as a natural predator who went around consuming worlds with baby Celestials in them in order to cull the herd.
That was the Earth X storyline
 

Edit: and we're meant to think that this group that is struggling to take on 1-3 deviants midway through the movie is the same group that killed alllll of the deviants as of 400 years ago.

The fight in the forest involves a deviant that had begun evolving
after it had already killed an Eternal.

I loved that fight in the forest, the way the grey dawn light slowly comes in over the course of the battle. The use of real locations and natural light really added to the film for me.

Also, the way Druig's villagers all fire in unison in that scene was really creepy.
 

Khelon Testudo

Cleric of Stronmaus
It was an enjoyable movie.

But it also had no real reason to be there, and no-one going forward is likely to complain if there are no sequels. I could be wrong, but I get the feeling that one of the Marvel big-wigs had an obsession with getting these folk to screen hell or high water. But he was the only one, so there was no consensus to enable a build-up, like Avengers had.

Letting us get to know each Avenger in their own movie first before putting the team together really seems how to do it. And people who skip that step miss out on the engagement needed to let the audience accept such a strange group of characters. This was missing with both Eternals, and Justice League. Although Snyder's Cut almost achieved the same goal, but by spending a lot of movie time setting up the characters.

More movie time than a modern cinema release will tolerate.
 

Janx

Hero
It was an enjoyable movie.

But it also had no real reason to be there, and no-one going forward is likely to complain if there are no sequels. I could be wrong, but I get the feeling that one of the Marvel big-wigs had an obsession with getting these folk to screen hell or high water. But he was the only one, so there was no consensus to enable a build-up, like Avengers had.

Letting us get to know each Avenger in their own movie first before putting the team together really seems how to do it. And people who skip that step miss out on the engagement needed to let the audience accept such a strange group of characters. This was missing with both Eternals, and Justice League. Although Snyder's Cut almost achieved the same goal, but by spending a lot of movie time setting up the characters.

More movie time than a modern cinema release will tolerate.
perhaps a counter to that is Guardians of the Galaxy. Which made a bunch of Marvel Nobodies work well.

A key difference is the smaller cast. How many eternals were there?

Probably another thing that bugs me with Marvel is how many completely different secret species they keep tucking away on earth. Eternals. Inhumans. Mutants. what else. Stick to one concept so we don't have to get into continuous "and why didn't THEY help with Thanos?" Marvel does a good job with individual characters and making them fit when they bring them in.
 

Dire Bare

Legend
Probably another thing that bugs me with Marvel is how many completely different secret species they keep tucking away on earth. Eternals. Inhumans. Mutants. what else. Stick to one concept so we don't have to get into continuous "and why didn't THEY help with Thanos?" Marvel does a good job with individual characters and making them fit when they bring them in.
It's the source material and ultimately, the genre. As long as you take it movie by movie, and don't overthink the numerous different "species" of supers, it's all good.
 

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