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Tonguez

A suffusion of yellow
Replying to you and the others who quoted me or mentioned this, I would have to go back and look at the official MCU stuff, but he was obviously active in all decades since the 40's. The question is how active, or how long he was allowed out to do his crimes? From what I can see, yes, he was cryogenically frozen, but only in between all the assassination missions he was given. So the real question is how many of those was he sent on? How many of the 50 years he was a Hydra assassin were spent frozen and how many were spent in training and on missions? Definitely not as many as Steve spent frozen. Bucky is 106, and the actor is 38, but looks younger than that. So even if Bucky spent 40 years total on ice of those 50, if there was no delayed aging from the serum, he should be played by an actor who looks 60-65 years old. Maybe instead of the freezing preventing the serum from halting aging, it did the opposite. Maybe Bucky and Steve stayed younger longer because the freezing enhanced the serum, rather than inhibited it.

Captain America was around 40 when he went back in time to 1949 and settled down with Peggy Carter, aging up the long way from there.
That means he did 70 years on ice and then another 70 years ‘normal’ aging - so he’s lived for 180 years, 70 years longer than Bucky.

Isaiah was active during the Korean War which was 68 years ago, he then aged up normally (no ice) from there. If he was in his 30ish in 1951 he’s be in his 80 - 90’s now, so even if he does look old it does seem that the serum has worked to keep him strong and healthy
 


Staffan

Adventurer
It's ironic that Charles Xavier's Korean War service (along with his stepbrother's) is largely downplayed and ignored while Magneto's formative years in the Holocaust are not. They really won't be able to keep Magneto's origins fixed there for much longer-- he should already be at least in his nineties, and they have already cloned and/or de-aged him at least once.
These days they have miracle medicines on Krakoa plus a resurrection system that can reset people's age, so I think they're good. One of Krakoa's main exports is a drug that can take 5 years off a human's age, so who knows what sort of good stuff they're keeping to themselves?

Charles has also been cloned twice. The first was at the end of the Brood saga back in the 80s, and the second is a little more complicated. A few years back, when Cyclops had the Phoenix Force, Scott killed Charles. Some time later, Charles' mind returned in Fantomex's body, but then that body got killed at the start of the Dawn of X comics. At that point, they cloned Charles' original body and re-inserted his mind into that, so now he's back in his own youthful body.

Also, Charles' service in the Korean War isn't a core element of his character, the way Magneto's experiences in Auschwitz are. The temple where Cain became the Juggernaut and Charles lost the use of his legs could be anywhere — the Korean war was just the excuse for putting Charles and Cain on the scene, not important in itself.

Magneto's a little weirder, because as you say he got reset to early adulthood (let's call it 20 for good measure) at some point. In the comics, this was in the 70s, but on account of sliding timescale it could really have been in the 80s or 90s as well. So assume he's 15-20 at the end of WW2, which would make him about 65-70 in the 90s (old, but not so old that he can't be active), at which point he gets reset back to 20. That'd make him biologically about 50 now. If you put his reboot in the 80s instead, now he's pushing 60.

But age has always been a really weird thing in Marvel. The worst example is Franklin Richards, who was born in the 60s, canonically 5 at the time of Onslaught (mid-90s), and 8 from at least 2004 to 2014. Now he's been aged up to a teen, though.
 

Marc_C

Solo Role Playing
Somehow I missed this, and I'd like to comment...

Modern racism uses exactly what you are saying as an excuse to deny it exists! The show is demonstrating to the audience how people who don't actually say or directly indicate, "I dislike you for the color of your skin," still are part of a cultural system that keeps people of color at a disadvantage.

The actual point is that the banker can argue to himself that there was nothing wrong with what happened!
Nothing so obvious of course. Thanks for the mansplaining.
 


Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
But age has always been a really weird thing in Marvel. The worst example is Franklin Richards, who was born in the 60s, canonically 5 at the time of Onslaught (mid-90s), and 8 from at least 2004 to 2014. Now he's been aged up to a teen, though.

There's also the Kitty Pryde/Rogue issue. Nominally, the two come into comics near the same tiem, and the same age - their mid-teens. However, very shortly Rogue is 21+, while Kitty remains 14 for a decade and more.
 


hopeless

Explorer
And they haven't introduced the Mutants yet!
So lets assume Magneto hails from Yugoslavia prior to its collapse in 1995 and make it more about that period instead?
 

billd91

Hobbit on Quest
And they haven't introduced the Mutants yet!
So lets assume Magneto hails from Yugoslavia prior to its collapse in 1995 and make it more about that period instead?
Because that's no where near as compelling as him being a survivor of the Holocaust, certainly not in formulating his worries about how humanity will treat mutants if he doesn't prevent it (in his own twisted way). Making Magneto a Holocaust survivor firmly put him in a very interesting narrative space. When he debuted, he was just some megalomaniac for mutantkind without any real insight into why. First the introduction of his lost wife Magda and then defining him as a Holocaust survivor really (and ironically) humanized him. His identity as a comic book villain took on a lot more depth.
I'm not sure the traumatic breakup of Yugoslavia carries the same weight. Balkan instability is working for Wanda, but Magneto would kind of suggest a higher order of magnitude.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
And they haven't introduced the Mutants yet!
So lets assume Magneto hails from Yugoslavia prior to its collapse in 1995 and make it more about that period instead?

That's one possibility, if separating him from the Holocaust is not deemed too disrespectful.

Or, you make him a kid in the 1970s... in Cambodia1. That'd make him middle-aged now, which works for the character, and also diversifies things a bit.



1. For those not aware, the Cambodian genocide of the 1970s claimed between 1.3 and 3 million lives. Cambodian genocide - Wikipedia
 
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Nikosandros

Golden Procrastinator
I got a cyberpunk vibe from the visuals and the glimpses of society in Madripoor in today's episode. Hpw is it normally represented in the comics?
 



Staffan

Adventurer
There's also the Kitty Pryde/Rogue issue. Nominally, the two come into comics near the same tiem, and the same age - their mid-teens. However, very shortly Rogue is 21+, while Kitty remains 14 for a decade and more.
I was always under the impression that Rogue was a little older than Kitty. Kitty was very specifically introduced as being 13 back in the Dark Phoenix saga, and got to age up (slowly) over the years, with one birthday being celebrated in space during the Brood saga and another while she was in the UK as part of Excalibur (well, the rest of Excalibur was off dimension-hopping at the time). Then things got confused when Warren Ellis took over Excalibur in the 90s and Kitty is apparently old enough to drink and snog Pete Wisdom, who's a proper adult.

Rogue, on the other hand, was consistently portrayed as a young adult. There's no indication in her original appearance fighting the Avengers alongside the Brotherhood that she's considered a child, nor when she and Mystique fight the X-Men some time later. When she's on the bus heading to Westchester to seek Xavier's help the caption describes her as a "young woman". So by the time she joins up, she's probably about 18-19 or so – and this is post-Brood and pre-Excalibur, so Kitty is 14 at the time.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
If Isaiah is a World War II veteran, the Super Soldier serum may not have stopped his aging but it sure as hell slowed it-- Cap and Bucky are over 100 years old, and Isaiah looked to be, maybe, in his sixties.
I don't know how many very active older folks you interact with, but I work with 60+ mechanics every day, and that guy is a jacked 70 year old, at least.
We have precedent for recasting headliners too. See: Hulk.
Well, recasting as you move a property from one studio to another is a different sort of thing. But recasting isn't the biggest problem, it's the idea of taking Steve's ending away without a really, really good story for it.
Huh. Put some bright colors on that jacket....I'm calling it, Walker is a Hydra agent.

Because come on, they're not done with Hydra.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
I was always under the impression that Rogue was a little older than Kitty.

Rogue's powers manifest when she's a "young teen". She kisses a boy, gets understandably freaked out, and runs away from home. She then takes up with Mystique - the term used in the comics is "adopted". That's not a term you normally use with an adult - so I find it hard to take her as 17+ at that point.
 

hopeless

Explorer
The below is in case it spoils anything from the latest episode.

So if they had access to a variant however weaker of the Erskine Super Soldier formula why isn't there more super soldiers?
I was assuming they didn't perfect the formula until the events of the Black Widow movie where they acquire a sample of the Russian variant and combining both manage to develop the one the Flag Smashers and US Agent is using.
So far they're halfway through the series and it feels odd.
 

The below is in case it spoils anything from the latest episode.

So if they had access to a variant however weaker of the Erskine Super Soldier formula why isn't there more super soldiers?
I was assuming they didn't perfect the formula until the events of the Black Widow movie where they acquire a sample of the Russian variant and combining both manage to develop the one the Flag Smashers and US Agent is using.
So far they're halfway through the series and it feels odd.
Not quite.
Nagel said he was still working on perfecting it for the CIA, using Isaiah's blood, when he got Snapped. When he came back, the program was gone, so he ended up finishing his work for the Power Broker, making 20 doses, that were all stolen by the Flag Smashers. Plus, the Black Widow movie is a prequel about her origin. It is not going to be set in the current time.
 

MarkB

Legend
The below is in case it spoils anything from the latest episode.

So if they had access to a variant however weaker of the Erskine Super Soldier formula why isn't there more super soldiers?
I was assuming they didn't perfect the formula until the events of the Black Widow movie where they acquire a sample of the Russian variant and combining both manage to develop the one the Flag Smashers and US Agent is using.
So far they're halfway through the series and it feels odd.
They specifically answered this in the episode.
The doctor who was working on cracking the formula based upon Hydra's work and Isaiah's blood samples had got most of the way there - but then he got Snapped. When he came alive again five years later the project had been mothballed. He managed to get hired by the Power Broker to complete his work, and had prepared twenty doses of the formula.

Then Karli and her Flag Smashers stole all 20 doses. They've used some of them to enhance themselves, but still have some in hand.
 

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