Forcing enemies to shift

[Li Shenron]

Tide of Iron, a physical shifting skill, explicitly states that you can only shift something one size category larger than you are, your size, or smaller. This is explicitly stated in the rules. Laid out in black in white. No exceptions.

Good. Let's hope other abilities based on strength are consistent with it.

 

[Stogoe]

I am talking about how the in-game effect is explained.

Explain it yourself. Each instance of the power will probably need a slightly different explanation from you because honestly, the rules are not the physics of the world. The rules only moderate the players' narrative interaction with the world.

 

[The Little Raven]

Magic abilities, I'm willing to take at face value, most of the time; martial abilities, I'm a little more leery of.

Meh, I prefer mythological heroes that can do impossible things like strangling two serpents while in the cradle, despite those serpents being sent to kill you by a goddess. This whole "magic uber alles" attitude is what makes non-spellcasters so boring in previous editions of the game.

 

[Lanefan]

This all assumes, of course, that the battles are taking place in a relatively open area, large cavern, or similar, where there's lots of room to move (and be moved) around. So far, it sounds like adventure design is gearing towards this.

In open-field battles in older editions I've seen and played PCs (and enemies) who do all kinds of moving around - running in and out of the battle, going for better positioning, etc. The AoO rules absolutely killed this in 3e - nobody dared move further than 5' once they were engaged.

For 4e, I'll be interested to see how these battles and abilities play out in more traditional small-scale dungeon settings, with 10'-wide passages and 20x20 rooms all full of combatants. And if I was building a place I wanted to defend, the last thing I'd want to do would be to incorporate lots of large open areas that only serve to give mobility-based attackers the advantage.

Lanefan

 

[Tuft]

Good. Let's hope other abilities based on strength are consistent with it.

Does Dexterity count? Positioning Strike (rogue lvl 1 power) together with the Artful Dodger rogue option moves an opponent of undefined size a distance equal to the rogue's Charisma modifier in any direction.

source: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dramp/20080222a&pf=true

 

[GnomeWorks]

Meh, I prefer mythological heroes that can do impossible things like strangling two serpents while in the cradle, despite those serpents being sent to kill you by a goddess. This whole "magic uber alles" attitude is what makes non-spellcasters so boring in previous editions of the game.

I'm fine with the fantastic. I just want to have solid explanations of it - and my requirements for those explanations are rather strict, I'll admit.

I like the idea of non-casters being on the same playing field as casters, in terms of usefulness. The wizard shouldn't be overshadowing the fighter at 5th level. But I believe that this can be accomplished without turning fighters into something other than folk with lots of skill (ie, bringing magic of some form into the equation).

 

[The Little Raven]

I'm fine with the fantastic. I just want to have solid explanations of it - and my requirements for those explanations are rather strict, I'll admit.

I like the idea of non-casters being on the same playing field as casters, in terms of usefulness. The wizard shouldn't be overshadowing the fighter at 5th level. But I believe that this can be accomplished without turning fighters into something other than folk with lots of skill (ie, bringing magic of some form into the equation).

*shrug* Just as most people have no problem with hand-waving something supernatural away as "Oh, it's magic." with no further explanation necessary, I have no problem with hand-waving something supernatural away as "It's the destiny of the hero to break the rules which bind mortal men to mundane life." with no further explanation.

 

[GnomeWorks]

*shrug* Just as most people have no problem with hand-waving something supernatural away as "Oh, it's magic." with no further explanation necessary, I have no problem with hand-waving something supernatural away as "It's the destiny of the hero to break the rules which bind mortal men to mundane life." with no further explanation.

While I find that particular explanation insufficient.

You enjoy one style of game, and I, another. Perhaps we should leave it at that?

 

[hong]

I'm fine with the fantastic. I just want to have solid explanations of it - and my requirements for those explanations are rather strict, I'll admit.

I like the idea of non-casters being on the same playing field as casters, in terms of usefulness. The wizard shouldn't be overshadowing the fighter at 5th level. But I believe that this can be accomplished without turning fighters into something other than folk with lots of skill (ie, bringing magic of some form into the equation).

And when you have accomplished this, you'll make millions!

 

[Falling Icicle]

How does this shifting work in character though? Can a halfling shift a gargantuan dragon for instance?

Yes. He stabs the dragon in the toe and it reels back in pain.