TSR Giantlands

[darjr]

Couple things worth noting:

1) Jim Ward claims that Dark Sun is a "Sci Fi" setting rather than Postapocalyptic Fantasy... which is patently ridiculous when GiantLands involves high tech and magic as their claim to the title.

2) Jim Ward having an incurable neurological disease may indicate a cognitive break or decline in which case we're giving a person with a physiological impairment a hard time for being impaired.

Though if that were the issue, the Dark Sun Sci Fi defense makes it ring pretty hollow since he has enough faculties to defend his position on a further spurious claim.

To be clear, and more fair. It was the giant lands Twitter that made the sci-fi claim of darksun. I’m confident James Ward doesn’t run that account.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

I fail to see how this is relevant to the thread - we're discussing the giantlands game, not Jim Ward's health a decade ago. I don't think 'if someone gets sick, you're not allowed to criticize their game or their statements' is a reasonable position, but that seems to be what you're doing. I'll also note that you're the one making this thread about Jim Ward personally - I commented only on the game and his statements about the game.

On the other hand, you started your first comment on this thread with the following:

The claims he's been making about the game sound overblown to the point of desperation. ...Spending a lot of effort making and defending really weak or spurious claims makes the game look much worse to me than if he didn't throw the overblown stuff into the conversation.

This heightens the appearance of desperation to me, since it makes it clear that he should know better as he's been involved with the overall genre to a large extent.

So, you were talking about someone else when you you used "he"? You were thinking of someobne else who made the claim and has been involved with the overall genre? You weren't piling on?

Whatever, man. Your post speaks for itself.

Look, own your own words. This games looks like a travesty. But unlike the other people involved (LaNassa, Gygax Jr., Dinehart), Jim Ward truly gave a lot to this hobby. And his involvement is a tragedy.

 

[Dessert Nomad]

2) Jim Ward having an incurable neurological disease may indicate a cognitive break or decline in which case we're giving a person with a physiological impairment a hard time for being impaired.

No, we're discussing public comments about the game and game itself. Having an impairment doesn't mean any product you release is immune from criticism. Trying to stifle discussion about a game and it's public marketing by claiming that criticism of the comments and game are somehow personal attacks on a disabled person is completely unreasonable, especially when it's not even clear that the comments are from that person. (Like darjr points out, the Giantlands twitter is likely not even run by Jim Ward).

 

[Shardstone]

Give me TSR and I'm making a Greyhawk OSR game and Castle Greyhawk is finally published

 

[Dessert Nomad]

On the other hand, you started your first comment on this thread with the following:

Anyone scrolling up can see that that was actually in my second comment in the thread, which was a reply to you. If you're going to go on a big 'own your words' rant, you should at least get the most basic facts of the matter straight.

So, you were talking about someone else when you you used "he"? You were thinking of someobne else who made the claim and has been involved with the overall genre? You weren't piling on? Whatever, man. Your post speaks for itself.

I was responding to your post (as indicated by me quoting your post), which claimed that the statements were from Ward, and not contesting that part of what you said. Acting like I'm doing something horribly wrong by taking your words at face value speaks a lot more about you and your posts than about me.

Look, own your own words. This games looks like a travesty. But unlike the other people involved (LaNassa, Gygax Jr., Dinehart), Jim Ward truly gave a lot to this hobby. And his involvement is a tragedy.

This looks like a non-sequitor to me; I don't see anyone in this thread disputing what Jim Ward has done in the past. But 'this guy did some good stuff decades ago' doesn't mean 'the current game he's working on is immune from criticism.'

 

[Sir Brennen]

Here's the original KickStarter, which is a year behind schedule (possibly pandemic-related delays? Haven't read all the updates).

The subsequent social media marketing has been more hyperbolic than what was on the original KS.

Giantlands Kickstarter

 

[Umbran]

I fail to see how this is relevant to the thread - we're discussing the giantlands game, not Jim Ward's health a decade ago. I don't think 'if someone gets sick, you're not allowed to criticize their game or their statements' is a reasonable position, but that seems to be what you're doing.

You yourself have mentioned desperation - have you considered that the desperation might stem from his health? When the successes we can name are from 30+ years ago, we can expect major chronic health issues to be quite a strain. Ward so far seems to be guilty of a few overblown statements about the game he wrote. On the scale of things said by folks in the TSR3 orbit, these are the least significant.

While you are correct that being ill doesn't make someone beyond criticism, there's also this thing called "empathy" that we should practice.

 

[Weiley31]

Seems like nothing big or even worthwhile to be excited about. (in a hypothetical world where they didn't sink their ship before leaving the flipping port.)

 

[Bolares]

There are so many good targets for heavy criticism and jokes in this TSR3 debacle, I don't know if Jim should be one of them....

 

[Umbran]

Mod Note:
@Snarf Zagyg and @Dessert Nomad - can you two dial it back about six notches? These threads don't need the antagonism. Thanks.