Handling a large group?

[SavageRobby]

Hmm. To be honest, I dunno. I never really paid much attention to the treasure guidelines in the DMG when we were still playing 3x. I think my players were what you'd probably call "deprived", though, comparatively.

As a whole, a larger group will be more powerful than a smaller one of the same levels, so you can safely scale back a bit on the treasure. You'll probably want to, in fact, because you're likely to have problems in the opposite direction than your orc tribe example. Because the group can tear through tougher encounters at lower levels, you will probably have to downgrade the treasure of some tougher monsters to make sure they really don't acquire bigger/better magic items earlier.

 

[JDJblatherings]

I've dm'd for as many as 14.

when runnign a game for large groups move away from the idea of just presenting adventutres you now actually have a chance to really present the campaign.

My advice keep everyone at the table but split them up...a lot. do not let them split up for long in the same dungeon but to let them split up in the same county or kingdom or plane depending on levels of play.
All 9 guys might not want to go berry picking in the forest of Nillish but two guys might want to , let them. you have a player population that allows you and them to explore and develop odd little nooks of your campaign you might have ignored before.

Use lots of cliff hangers to switch from one subgroup to the next. It keeps un involved players attention and eagerness up. you can also resolve soem cliff hangers off screen if it isn't a big deal...player just webbed a room full of kobolds do a cliff hanger switch. come back to them and the kobolds have all been dealt with and the room is looted.

Plan breaks and stick to planned break times, even bathroom breaks. I once had one campaign where we played for 2 or 3 hours then had a 1 to 2 hour break in in the middle to eat, play some sports, fix records, get friendly chatter out of the way and then played for another 3+ hours after that.

do use annoying player knowldge puzzles and swith the action to others while the puzzle is being worked on.

Write out treasure lists and hand them to the players. don't spend table time describing a whole treasure haul.

Let other players briefly play the roles of other PCs familairs, animal companions, followers and even summoned monsters. that way soem folks have stuff to do when they aren't in the scene and it adds more depth to the npcs plus it drops some work for the DM.

Keep very careful records of everyithing certainly time and location of PCs.

don't be afraid to kill 2 or 3 PCs in a sesion, it will not derail the whole campaign. Well it still could but it is unlikely.

make everyone keeps careful account of where their stuff is item loaning could become a real pain in the butt otherwise with so many players.

 

[Dross]

Thanks for all the advice - I'll have to run a great deal of it past the group before it gets a carved in stone ruling.

My last question would be - treasure. (huh - ended with a period - guess that is a statement).

Sounds like the two people who have run larger groups (Savage and Maddman) for a while do away with ecl/cr, so how do handle treasure? dole out enough to keep the group as whole on par with the character wealth stuff from the DMG?

Possibly with ECL/CR you simply need to double the foes (for an 8 member party).

However for treasure maybe a different approach is useful.

Do they have enough items to get the job done?

This does not mean that they have the ability to counter everything they encounter all the time (like say silver weapons v lycanthropes) but for the run of the mill encounters they have enough magic items/spells/weapons for those things that they meet. Then on occassion you can use something that they don't have a specific counter for.

As for speeding up play. If you trust your players enough, have them roll ahead of their go so they can simply say what they are doing.

Try to have one of the players do something to ease your load (like the suggested initiative list).

A party/player leader is a useful tool to help keep things moving.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Hello Shadow64,

I'm an experienced DM and have been running an Age of Worms campaign using the D&D rules as written for the last two years with seven player characters, all currently at 14th level (me the DM making 8 of us with six of the seven players being DMs in their own right).

If you can cut the group down a little, you WILL have a more enjoyable game for all concerned (particularly you). Take others advice of splitting/downsizing the group if you can. At low levels, you will be mostly fine but by the time you hit about eight or nine, things will start get much trickier.

If you cannot, I would recommend the following:
- Have one player (who sits near or next to you) as a dedicated initiative person. Purchase Paizo's initiative tracker as it is worth every dollar and more with a large group. They manange the tracker while you direct the party as to who is up (as well as who is following them).
- You manage all character sheets, making sure all is ready for gameday, emailing players if there are any queries. You don't want to dedicate the first hour and more (and yes that can happen very easily) of your game to such details that can and should be worked out well beforehand.
- All spellcasters have every spell they can cast in card form. This makes it easier for them to quickly flick through their options when it is their turn. You will find in a large group, spellcasters take much longer than others in combat ad so having them as prepared as possible is essential. Any summoned creature must also have their own card. I have a rule that if you don't have the card, you don't have the spell or you can't summon the creature. The MM just simply does not cut it when you are trying to keep things moving.
- Likewise, have all your own stuff at hand broken down into specific encounters. Grab an encounter out of your folder, detailing all requisite stats, spells, things not to forget etc. With a large group, you just have to be organised.

All this may sound like overkill (particularly if you just have a bunch of 1st level characters), but I can tell you from experience that if you think battles are slow at low levels, you should see them at higher levels, things can simply crawl to a halt. Oh and by the way, that thing about having players roll attacks and damage dice at the same time, it does not save that much time at lower levels and at higher levels, it breaks down. I find it much easier when you have multiple attacks (our two weapon fighter has up to six at present), to just roll all the attack rolls first, work out the number of hits and then work out the damage as suits.

As for treasure, I have found including more gold/gems is better than items for a large group (if you want to follow the recommended treasure table). The only thing is you have to have a method of turning that gold into magical items. Not very glamourous but it saves a little angst over item distribution. Generally for your group, just double the treasure you would hand out for a regular 4 PC group.

By the way, what campaign are you running (home brew or published).

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Silver Moon]

My advice is to simplify the rules to keep things flowing. I have successfully run a campaign with 14 active players - but that was using 1st Edition rules - I don't think you'll have the same success with 3rd Edition rules if you decide to play everything by the book.

 

[JDJblatherings]

fixed intitiative- set everyones initiative at 10+ modifiers. order ties by DEX and level.
NPCs act after PCs on ties...it's good to be the hero.

roll at the begining of fight for encounters and keep it there the whole fight.

enforce a 'if you don't talkyou character doesn't act' rule. when yuo get to them, they've had plenty of time to decide what to do. I give folks a five count if they can't tell me then when it is their turn during a fight them i move to the next player.

I don't do 'oh i forgot a modifier my score was actually 16 not 13. the reply is something like "too bad your character couldn't apply his skills to the fullest, I'm sure next time he will"

 

[Shadow64]

Hello Shadow64,
By the way, what campaign are you running (home brew or published).

For now we are playing Eberron. That leaves a lot of the load of my shoulders for world creation, but at the same time - I don't have the time to read and absorb everything in the books, but I have a few people in the group who know the setting very well.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

I don't do 'oh i forgot a modifier my score was actually 16 not 13. the reply is something like "too bad your character couldn't apply his skills to the fullest, I'm sure next time he will"

What if they go "my score was actually 13 not 16". Do you then say "too bad, your character appllied his skills beyond his abilities, I'm sure next time he will be far less competent"?

Sorry, I could not resist.

For now we are playing Eberron. That leaves a lot of the load of my shoulders for world creation, but at the same time - I don't have the time to read and absorb everything in the books, but I have a few people in the group who know the setting very well.

I gather then you are playing a published module. I'd definitely go double treasure with an emphasis on that second half being mainly gold and gems.
In terms of encounters, try to picture who is going to be fighting who. If you can up the number of opponents (not necessarily to double), then you can make sure everyone has something to do in combat. Try different things out and I'm sure you'll get the hang of it quick enough.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[Shadow64]

I gather then you are playing a published module.

Nope - just the setting and the supporting books to give me the playground. All the adventures I have laid out right now are all my own.

Not that I hate modules - but in all the games i've played in the modules , or the dm, have just sucked - so it hasn't been the best experience.

Given that a few members of my group have extolled the virtues of some of the dragon/dungeon modules I will probably take a look at them for ideas and go from there.

 

[Graybeard]

I DM for a group of 6 players. I run a homebrew world and make my own adventures. I don't pay too much attention to CRs and ECLs. I learned that early on. The PCs would easily beat almost anything I threw at them. Most of the combats that are challenging involve large groups of lower level bad guys/monsters. Another thing that has helped make combat interesting is surprise. One encounter near an old abandoned temple had a disguised hag running towards the group yelling for help. There were 2 bugbears running after her. The PCs immediately ran to intercept the bugbears while the hag ran to the party mage and started attacking him. It took him by surprise and the players loved it.

The most difficult part is making sure everyone gets a chance to roleplay and do something other than combat. This is perhaps the most challenging aspect of DMing a large group.

Good luck.