House Rules for Spike Growth

[Celebrim]

I just had PC acquire 'Spike Growth' as a spell. Oddly this is the first time I've had a PC learn the spell and for some reason this is also the first time I've ever looked hard at the spell. Looking at it, it appears to be beyond the power level of spells of its level in my rebalanced 3.Xe. Specifically I'm worried about the following:

a) It appears that the spikes are invisible and no mechanic for seeing them is provided other than a rogue's search check, which is ridiculously hard.
b) The area of effect is huge, amounting to 2800 square feet at 7th level.
c) No mechanic for moving through the spike field without being harmed is provided for.
d) Damage seems excessive for the description.
e) The totality of the spell seems to be dissociated. If the spikes are huge enough to skewer like spears or longswords, why are they so hard to detect? How is it possible that the effected squares are only difficult terrain and yet its not possible by moving slowly to avoid the spikes entirely? Even if the spikes blend into the environment, if they are thin blades of rock, how are they so difficult to detect that even something as simple as swinging a staff around doesn't find and eventually locate them?

Describe to me how you imagine and describe 'spike growth' in game.

What sorts of changes have you made to the rules to make the spell less abusive?

 

[Celebrim]

Proposed wording #1 for Spike Growth:

"Any ground-covering vegetation in the spell’s area becomes very hard and sharply pointed without changing its appearance. In areas of bare earth, roots and rootlets act in the same way. Typically, spike growth can be cast in any outdoor setting except open water, ice, heavy snow, sandy desert, or bare stone.

Each square so effected counts as difficult terrain and any creature of small size or larger that enters the area must pick its way carefully if they are not to take 1d4 piercing damage for each 5’ of travel. Creatures moving at half-speed must make a DC 15 balance check for each 5’, those at full speed a DC 20, and those that attempt to run automatically take damage.

Any creature that takes damage from this spell must also succeed on a Fortitude save to avoid injuries to its feet and legs. A failed save causes the creature’s speed to be reduced to half normal for 24 hours or until the injured creature receives a cure spell (which also restores lost hit points). Another character can remove the penalty by taking 10 minutes to dress the injuries and succeeding on a Heal check against the spell’s save DC.

The spike growths are colored so that they blend into the background effectively, and they are not easily seen and practically invisible until a character is almost on top of them. Characters within 5’ of a field of spike growths are entitled to a DC 20 spot check to observe the danger. Otherwise, they do not observe their presence until they first impale themselves. No balance check is allowed until the spikes are observed, and charging or running creatures automatically fail this check, being in any event unable to stop their headlong rush in time.

Creatures within the area of effect of the spell at the time of casting automatically take 1d4 damage."


Proposed wording #1 for Spike Stones:

"Rocky ground, stone floors, and similar surfaces shape themselves into a bramble of random long, razor sharp stone points as high as 4’ off the ground that impede progress through the area and deal damage. Each square so effected counts as difficult terrain and any creature of small size or larger that enters the area must pick its way carefully if they are not to take 1d8 piercing damage for each 5’ of travel. Creatures moving at half-speed must make a DC 15 balance check for each 5’, those at full speed a DC 20, and those that attempt to run automatically take damage.

Any creature that takes damage from this spell must also succeed on a Fortitude save to avoid injuries to its feet and legs. A failed save causes the creature’s speed to be reduced to half normal for 24 hours or until the injured creature receives a cure spell (which also restores lost hit points). Another character can remove the penalty by taking 10 minutes to dress the injuries and succeeding on a Heal check against the spell’s save DC.

The stone spikes are colored so that they blend into the background effectively, and they are not easily seen and practically invisible until a character is almost on top of them. Characters within 5’ of a field of stone spikes are entitled to a DC 20 spot check to observe the danger. Otherwise, they do not observe their presence until they first impale themselves. No balance check is allowed until the spikes are observed, and charging or running creatures automatically fail this check, being in any event unable to stop their headlong rush in time.

Creatures within the area of effect of the spell at the time of casting automatically take 1d8 damage."

The idea being imagined here is more like an undergrowth of spears than a dense carpet of stone nails.

A "dense carpet of nails" however is possible. That interpretation would to me much more strongly suggest lower damage (akin to caltrops) and suggest a more caltrop like approach to resolution (attacks against AC).

 

[Sadrik]

I think those make sense.
Make Spike Growth caltrops but 1d4, and your spotting it rules
Make Spike stones caltrops but 1d8, and your spotting it rules

Also, I have always felt that the 1/2 speed thing should be a condition. It is used three times in the rules.

Caltrops

A caltrop is a four-pronged iron spike crafted so that one prong faces up no matter how the caltrop comes to rest. You scatter caltrops on the ground in the hope that your enemies step on them or are at least forced to slow down to avoid them. One 2-pound bag of caltrops covers an area 5 feet square.

Each time a creature moves into an area covered by caltrops (or spends a round fighting while standing in such an area), it might step on one. The caltrops make an attack roll (base attack bonus +0) against the creature. For this attack, the creature’s shield, armor, and deflection bonuses do not count. If the creature is wearing shoes or other footwear, it gets a +2 armor bonus to AC. If the caltrops succeed on the attack, the creature has stepped on one. The caltrop deals 1 point of damage, and the creature’s speed is reduced by one-half because its foot is wounded. This movement penalty lasts for 24 hours, or until the creature is successfully treated with a DC 15 Heal check, or until it receives at least 1 point of magical curing. A charging or running creature must immediately stop if it steps on a caltrop. Any creature moving at half speed or slower can pick its way through a bed of caltrops with no trouble.

Caltrops may not be effective against unusual opponents.

Floors

As with walls, dungeon floors come in many types.

Flagstone
Like masonry walls, flagstone floors are made of fitted stones. They are usually cracked and only somewhat level. Slime and mold grows in these cracks. Sometimes water runs in rivulets between the stones or sits in stagnant puddles. Flagstone is the most common dungeon floor.
Uneven Flagstone

Over time, some floors can become so uneven that a DC 10 Balance check is required to run or charge across the surface. Failure means the character can’t move in this round. Floors as treacherous as this should be the exception, not the rule.

Hewn Stone Floors
Rough and uneven, hewn floors are usually covered with loose stones, gravel, dirt, or other debris. A DC 10 Balance check is required to run or charge across such a floor. Failure means the character can still act, but can’t run or charge in this round.

Light Rubble
Small chunks of debris litter the ground. Light rubble adds 2 to the DC of Balance and Tumble checks.
Dense Rubble

The ground is covered with debris of all sizes. It costs 2 squares of movement to enter a square with dense rubble. Dense rubble adds 5 to the DC of Balance and Tumble checks, and it adds 2 to the DC of Move Silently checks.

Smooth Stone Floors
Finished and sometimes even polished, smooth floors are found only in dungeons with capable and careful builders.
Natural Stone Floors

The floor of a natural cave is as uneven as the walls. Caves rarely have flat surfaces of any great size. Rather, their floors have many levels. Some adjacent floor surfaces might vary in elevation by only a foot, so that moving from one to the other is no more difficult than negotiating a stair step, but in other places the floor might suddenly drop off or rise up several feet or more, requiring Climb checks to get from one surface to the other. Unless a path has been worn and well marked in the floor of a natural cave, it takes 2 squares of movement to enter a square with a natural stone floor, and the DC of Balance and Tumble checks increases by 5. Running and charging are impossible, except along paths.

Special Floors

Slippery
Water, ice, slime, or blood can make any of the dungeon floors described in this section more treacherous. Slippery floors increase the DC of Balance and Tumble checks by 5.

Grate
A grate often covers a pit or an area lower than the main floor. Grates are usually made from iron, but large ones can also be made from iron-bound timbers. Many grates have hinges to allow access to what lies below (such grates can be locked like any door), while others are permanent and designed not to move. A typical 1-inch-thick iron grate has 25 hit points, hardness 10, and a DC of 27 for Strength checks to break through it or tear it loose.

Ledge
Ledges allow creatures to walk above some lower area. They often circle around pits, run along underground streams, form balconies around large rooms, or provide a place for archers to stand while firing upon enemies below. Narrow ledges (12 inches wide or less) require those moving along them to make Balance checks. Failure results in the moving character falling off the ledge. Ledges sometimes have railings. In such a case, characters gain a +5 circumstance bonus on Balance checks to move along the ledge. A character who is next to a railing gains a +2 circumstance bonus on his or her opposed Strength check to avoid being bull rushed off the edge.

Ledges can also have low walls 2 to 3 feet high along their edges. Such walls provide cover against attackers within 30 feet on the other side of the wall, as long as the target is closer to the low wall than the attacker is.
Transparent Floor

Transparent floors, made of reinforced glass or magic materials (even a wall of force), allow a dangerous setting to be viewed safely from above. Transparent floors are sometimes placed over lava pools, arenas, monster dens, and torture chambers. They can be used by defenders to watch key areas for intruders.

Sliding Floors
A sliding floor is a type of trapdoor, designed to be moved and thus reveal something that lies beneath it. A typical sliding floor moves so slowly that anyone standing on one can avoid falling into the gap it creates, assuming there’s somewhere else to go. If such a floor slides quickly enough that there’s a chance of a character falling into whatever lies beneath—a spiked pit, a vat of burning oil, or a pool filled with sharks—then it’s a trap.

Trap Floors
Some floors are designed to become suddenly dangerous. With the application of just the right amount of weight, or the pull of a lever somewhere nearby, spikes protrude from the floor, gouts of steam or flame shoot up from hidden holes, or the entire floor tilts. These strange floors are sometimes found in an arena, designed to make combats more exciting and deadly. Construct these floors as you would any other trap.

 

[Celebrim]

I think those make sense.
Make Spike Growth caltrops but 1d4, and your spotting it rules
Make Spike stones caltrops but 1d8, and your spotting it rules.

I've also been leaning toward a caltrops based rules set, simply increasing slightly the 'to hit' and damage. Balancing the spell is then fairly easy as it loses its level invariant nature because it no longer attacks something that doesn't depend on CR.

 

[Celebrim]

Proposed wording #2 for Spike Growth:

"Any ground-covering vegetation in the spell’s area becomes very hard and sharply pointed without changing its appearance. In areas of bare earth, roots and rootlets act in the same way. Typically, spike growth can be cast in any outdoor setting except open water, ice, heavy snow, sandy desert, or bare stone.

Each square so effected counts as uneven difficult terrain and when any creature of tiny size or larger enters an area of spiked growth or spends a round fighting while standing in such an area, it may step on one or more spikes. In such situations, the spikes make an attack roll (base attack bonus +3) against the creature. For this attack, the creature’s shield, armor, and deflection bonuses do not count. If the creature is wearing hard soled shoes or similar footwear, it gets a +2 armor bonus to AC. If the spikes succeed on the attack, the creature has stepped on one or more spikes and suffers 1d3 damage. Spikes count as +1 magical weapons for the purposes of overcoming DR.

Any creature that takes damage from this spell must also succeed on a Fortitude save to avoid injuries to its feet and legs. A failed save causes the creature’s speed to be reduced to half normal for 24 hours or until the injured creature receives a cure spell (which also restores lost hit points). Another character can remove the penalty by taking 10 minutes to dress the injuries and succeeding on a Heal check against the spell’s save DC.

Creatures within the area of effect of the spell at the time of casting automatically receive attacks and lose their dexterity bonus against such attacks if they were flat-footed. Creatures that fall prone in the area effect receive a normal attack (that does not bypass armor) with a +2 circumstance modifier on the check, and if this attack succeeds they take double damage. If the creatures falls onto this surface from height, use the normal rules for falling onto short spikes.

The spike growths are colored so that they blend into the background effectively, and they are not easily seen and practically invisible until a character is almost on top of them. Characters within 5’ of a field of spike growths are entitled to a DC 20 spot check to observe the danger. Otherwise, they do not observe their presence until they first impale themselves. Charging or running creatures automatically fail this check, being in any event unable to stop their headlong rush in time. On the other hand, a character moving carefully and probing the floor ahead requires only a DC 10 search check to notice the unusually hard projections."

Proposed wording #2 for Stone Spikes:

Rocky ground, stone floors, and similar surfaces shape themselves into a bramble of random razor sharp stone points that impede progress through the area and deal damage. Each square so effected counts as difficult uneven terrain and any creature of tiny size or larger that enters an area of stone spikes or spends a round fighting while standing in such an area may step on one or more spikes. In such situations, the spikes make an attack roll (base attack bonus +6) against the creature. For this attack, the creature’s shield, armor, and deflection bonuses do not count. If the creature is wearing hard soled shoes or similar footwear, it gets a +2 armor bonus to AC. If the spikes succeed on the attack, the creature has stepped on one or more spikes and suffers 1d6 damage. Stone spikes count as +1 magical weapons for the purposes of overcoming DR.

Any creature that takes damage from this spell must also succeed on a Fortitude save to avoid injuries to its feet and legs. A failed save causes the creature’s speed to be reduced to half normal for 24 hours or until the injured creature receives a cure spell (which also restores lost hit points). Another character can remove the penalty by taking 10 minutes to dress the injuries and succeeding on a Heal check against the spell’s save DC.

Creatures within the area of effect of the spell at the time of casting automatically receive attacks and lose their dexterity bonus against such attacks if they were flat-footed. Creatures that fall prone in the area effect receive a normal attack (that does not bypass armor) with a +2 circumstance modifier on the check, and if this attack succeeds they take double damage. If the creature falls onto this surface from height, use the normal rules for falling onto long spikes.

The spike growths are colored so that they blend into the background effectively, and they are not easily seen and practically invisible until a character is almost on top of them. Characters within 5’ of a field of spike growths are entitled to a DC 20 spot check to observe the danger. Otherwise, they do not observe their presence until they first impale themselves. Charging or running creatures automatically fail this check, being in any event unable to stop their headlong rush in time. On the other hand, a character moving very slowly and carefully and probing the floor ahead (as with a pole or staff) requires only a DC 10 search check to notice the unusually hard projections."