D&D 5E How Is This Balanced?

Moorcrys

Explorer
Transmuted Spell metamagic from Tasha’s might help with the fire issue. Maybe a bloodwell vial to give them a few extra SPs as well.

Also - if you don’t want to add some spells known to the dragon sorcerer to bring them in line with the design of the newer bloodlines, you might want to consider having their sorcerer find some kind of a staff. That will give them some extra spell versatility (heck you can design the staff to give them access to a few spells you think would really help them if you want) that’s thematically in line with their class choice. Staffs are awesome for sorcerers imho.
 

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aco175

Legend
I have no problems with giving items out that have cool powers. For the sorcerer, I may have something that changers the type of damage from fire to cold or radiant. Also, just a staff of lightning with several charged powers goes a long way. I do like the ability to overcome fire resistance to some extent.

Is the bigger problem that some of the players are newer and not used to casters or good at picking spells.
 

Tasha book Got some new helping features for a sorcerer.
transmuted spell can help against resistance and imunity.
Sorcerous versatility can help to become more skill wise.

The later should already be available to the pc, the metamagic can be allowed through retrain, or by a magic item. there is no reasons to let a player on the B team.
 

auburn2

Adventurer
This comment was made by a Dragon Sorcerer in regards to a Light Cleric and Sorc1/Twilight Cleric. All PCs are level 8.

We only have 1 dedicated front line type in the party a paladin with a Ranged rogue rounding out the party.

To be fair I regard a Dragon Sorcerer as B tier Sorcerer and those two clerics as S tier.

Anyway the twilight cleric tends to wade into melee combat and the light cleric started as a ranged PC but has kind of copied the twilight clerics spells.

Both clerics are wisdom based and use spiritual weapon/guardians, guiding Bolt, toll the dead and inflict woubds.The MC one uses booming blade.

Not much is resistant to necrotic/radiant/force.

The fire Sorcerer is exactly that and has encounteed fire resistant critters and isn't good in melee.

One of the clerics players is also not the best skill wise the Dragon Sorcerer not so much.

Anyway ideas? I'm thinking of tweaking some of the encounters so the fire Sorcerer won't be so screwed but the big bad is still a fire giant. He can also cast haste or twin it.

Normally a you broke it you buy it type DM but getting soft in old age.
If the sorc invested in charisma skills put in some conversational role playing he can excell in. Use ranged enemies.
 

Shiroiken

Legend
Cleric - I'm currently playing a Spirit Guardians focused cleric, so I know their weaknesses. Are you using 6-8 encounters per long rest, and what level are you working with? Until you start to get into the 10+ level range, you just can't do it every combat, so you have to pick your fights (I normally use Bless on those other fights). Concentration is also a real pain, and without Warcaster or Resilient it's very easy to lose the spell when you wade into melee (especially since you should immediately aggro every enemy). If built towards, this is a pretty powerful build for most types of fights, for as long as you have the spell slots.

Fire Dragon Sorcerer - My first 5E campaign had one of these. It was fairly strong at the time, but she didn't face many monsters that were fire resistant/immune until about level 10. She took the feat that allowed her to bypass resistance, leaving only fire immune creatures as an issue. Knowing we were going to be facing giants, and expecting fire giants, she picked a handful of spells, plus one cantrip, that did non-fire damage (although she adamantly refused to ever deal cold damage). When they faced the Hall of the Fire Giant King, she was woefully under-powered compared to the rest of the party, but until then she'd been the DPR star of the show. Afterwards she was somewhat outpaced by the Eldritch Knight Archer, but that was largely due to him picking up a 3rd attack, sharpshooter, and a badass magic bow (based on the Hank's bow from the D&D cartoon). IMO it's still the strongest sorcerer build outside of Divine Soul, but the DM should work with the player before starting to campaign if one element is going to be heavily resisted/ignored.
 

Tales and Chronicles

Jewel of the North, formerly know as vincegetorix
There's the spell shards in Tasha's that can be a powerful and thematic boost to the sorcerer.

Apart from that, if they want to keep the dragon theme, I'd go for fear/charm spells instead of just damage ones.
 


Zardnaar

Legend
Cleric - I'm currently playing a Spirit Guardians focused cleric, so I know their weaknesses. Are you using 6-8 encounters per long rest, and what level are you working with? Until you start to get into the 10+ level range, you just can't do it every combat, so you have to pick your fights (I normally use Bless on those other fights). Concentration is also a real pain, and without Warcaster or Resilient it's very easy to lose the spell when you wade into melee (especially since you should immediately aggro every enemy). If built towards, this is a pretty powerful build for most types of fights, for as long as you have the spell slots.

Fire Dragon Sorcerer - My first 5E campaign had one of these. It was fairly strong at the time, but she didn't face many monsters that were fire resistant/immune until about level 10. She took the feat that allowed her to bypass resistance, leaving only fire immune creatures as an issue. Knowing we were going to be facing giants, and expecting fire giants, she picked a handful of spells, plus one cantrip, that did non-fire damage (although she adamantly refused to ever deal cold damage). When they faced the Hall of the Fire Giant King, she was woefully under-powered compared to the rest of the party, but until then she'd been the DPR star of the show. Afterwards she was somewhat outpaced by the Eldritch Knight Archer, but that was largely due to him picking up a 3rd attack, sharpshooter, and a badass magic bow (based on the Hank's bow from the D&D cartoon). IMO it's still the strongest sorcerer build outside of Divine Soul, but the DM should work with the player before starting to campaign if one element is going to be heavily resisted/ignored.

No haven't been doing the 6-8 encounters thing as it's been mostly exploration. RL pacing also interferes as I have to run that over 3 sessions or so.
 

tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
Cleric - I'm currently playing a Spirit Guardians focused cleric, so I know their weaknesses. Are you using 6-8 encounters per long rest, and what level are you working with? Until you start to get into the 10+ level range, you just can't do it every combat, so you have to pick your fights (I normally use Bless on those other fights). Concentration is also a real pain, and without Warcaster or Resilient it's very easy to lose the spell when you wade into melee (especially since you should immediately aggro every enemy). If built towards, this is a pretty powerful build for most types of fights, for as long as you have the spell slots.

Fire Dragon Sorcerer - My first 5E campaign had one of these. It was fairly strong at the time, but she didn't face many monsters that were fire resistant/immune until about level 10. She took the feat that allowed her to bypass resistance, leaving only fire immune creatures as an issue. Knowing we were going to be facing giants, and expecting fire giants, she picked a handful of spells, plus one cantrip, that did non-fire damage (although she adamantly refused to ever deal cold damage). When they faced the Hall of the Fire Giant King, she was woefully under-powered compared to the rest of the party, but until then she'd been the DPR star of the show. Afterwards she was somewhat outpaced by the Eldritch Knight Archer, but that was largely due to him picking up a 3rd attack, sharpshooter, and a badass magic bow (based on the Hank's bow from the D&D cartoon). IMO it's still the strongest sorcerer build outside of Divine Soul, but the DM should work with the player before starting to campaign if one element is going to be heavily resisted/ignored.
To a degree wotc strongly pushes this in 5e. With few exceptions (almost all of which are )"iconic" spells like lightning bolt the majority of damage spells that aren't fire are lower damage or much lower damage with a debuff that may or may not & rarely will rise above being questionably useful in some contrived situation. The exceptions that exist are often spread around randomly with no meaningful progression even if you include the lemons.

A lot of the spells in tasha's are better but still mechanically function as if 5e is heavy LFQW rather than gross lwqf for damage output so often wind up feeling like they fall short in petty ways for damage nondamage & specially hybrid spells. Take mindsliver for example
it has a blisteringly short duration debuff that might be mildly useful in a caster heavy party thick on save or x attacks and damage that look like
1618777975314.png


1618778083390.png
The damage is so bad the only purpose it serves is keeping it from being a good debuff that doesn't deal damage & the debuff so minor on top of short lived the inverse is true for the damage. You can see this kind of thing play out again & again even in leveled spells. It's not a case of advanced math is hard, it's a case of "someone quit doing the trivial simple math long ago & wotc has been perpetuating a myth carried over from past editions where it was true"
 

To a degree wotc strongly pushes this in 5e. With few exceptions (almost all of which are )"iconic" spells like lightning bolt the majority of damage spells that aren't fire are lower damage or much lower damage with a debuff that may or may not & rarely will rise above being questionably useful in some contrived situation. The exceptions that exist are often spread around randomly with no meaningful progression even if you include the lemons.

A lot of the spells in tasha's are better but still mechanically function as if 5e is heavy LFQW rather than gross lwqf for damage output so often wind up feeling like they fall short in petty ways for damage nondamage & specially hybrid spells. Take mindsliver for example
it has a blisteringly short duration debuff that might be mildly useful in a caster heavy party thick on save or x attacks and damage that look like The damage is so bad the only purpose it serves is keeping it from being a good debuff that doesn't deal damage & the debuff so minor on top of short lived the inverse is true for the damage. You can see this kind of thing play out again & again even in leveled spells. It's not a case of advanced math is hard, it's a case of "someone quit doing the trivial simple math long ago & wotc has been perpetuating a myth carried over from past editions where it was true"
I think you are underestimating the utility of such a debuff. If you are a sorcerer with heightened spell and you want to be sure your single slot level X spell sticks, this spell is exactly what you want: first, quickened mind sliver for -d4 on your next spell and if it works, cast your heightened spell. If you only have one chance, you better prepare it well.
If you are looking for damage, don't look at wizard cantrips.
 

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