D&D (2024) How long should a Short rest be in 5E(2024)?

How long should a Short rest be?

  • 1 Minute

    Votes: 1 1.0%
  • 5 Minutes

    Votes: 32 33.0%
  • 15 Minutes

    Votes: 20 20.6%
  • 1 Hour

    Votes: 22 22.7%
  • Removed!

    Votes: 6 6.2%
  • Other duration?

    Votes: 16 16.5%

Vaalingrade

Legend
If an encounter is not Deadly+ what is the point of having it?
Action set pieces to let the party show off their capabilities, see the capabilities of a cool monster/NPC and blow off steam.

That's all I need, frankly.

I personally have zero use for Deadly+ encounters.
 

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TheSword

Legend
Action set pieces to let the party show off their capabilities, see the capabilities of a cool monster/NPC and blow off steam.

That's all I need, frankly.

I personally have zero use for Deadly+ encounters.
There’s lots of people who like combat to mean a bit more than your average sanitized WWF match. People who want actual jeopardy and danger rather than a computer game on ‘story mode’.

I can get through Witcher 3 in about 16 hours when I can regain health instantly with simple meditation and all the enemies are a pushover. Or I can play it on a proper difficulty setting and actually enjoy the challenge of the game that makes you think a bit more and approach things with a bit of healthy respect.
 

Vaalingrade

Legend
Nothing about that is "kinetic". It'sclose asap> rockem sockem robots rocket tag>letstTakeAShortRest
I have no idea what you're trying to say. Rock-em sockem robots and rocket tag are mutually exclusive. You can't instantly gib a robot in the rock'em sock'em game. It might just be easier to write [Generic Onsult]

Previously, combat as 'sticky' you closed on your foe, then stopped moving until one of you were dead. In 5e's system, you can actually hit in run or strike in passing. It's not much, but it is an improvement.
 

Vaalingrade

Legend
There’s lots of people who like combat to mean a bit more than your average sanitized WWF match. People who want actual jeopardy and danger rather than a computer game on ‘story mode’.
Okay?

Look, I actively put in the words 'I personally' this time and that still didn't stop this kind of thing, must less another [Generic Insult] (lol, video games! something more successful culturally than our hobby is an insult!). That's why I don't bother and if someone tries to 'that's just your opinion, man' me again, I'm going to link this sequence.

Edit:
"Why do people like pie?"

"Because it's delicious."

"Well some people have refined tastes and like cakes instead. Also, they aren't stupid and ugly'.

Excellent discourse.
 
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tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
I have no idea what you're trying to say. Rock-em sockem robots and rocket tag are mutually exclusive. You can't instantly gib a robot in the rock'em sock'em game. It might just be easier to write [Generic Onsult]

Previously, combat as 'sticky' you closed on your foe, then stopped moving until one of you were dead. In 5e's system, you can actually hit in run or strike in passing. It's not much, but it is an improvement.
They are both mindless and when combined result in something void of any thought strategy or consequences beyond button mashing. You get the equivalent of a bullethell game where you don't need to avoid any of the bullets.
 

Vaalingrade

Legend
They are both mindless and when combined result in something void of any thought strategy or consequences beyond button mashing. You get the equivalent of a bullethell game where you don't need to avoid any of the bullets.
How does more mobility lead to less strategy? Especially less than 'charge to target, swing until dead', maybe flank.

Also, the monsters can move too. And they're almost universally as fast as or faster than PCs.
 

Staffan

Legend
3e had two aspects to it that made melee fights devolve into "stand next to the other guy and wail on each other until one is dead".

1. Full attacks. If you wanted to make all of your attacks, you couldn't move more than 5 ft in a round. Moving more would take a move action, which meant you could only make a standard (single) attack.

2. Attacks of opportunity. If you moved out of a square within an opponent's reach without taking precautions, they'd get a free attack.

In 5e, #1 is completely gone, and #2 is significantly reduced – now you only take an opportunity attack if you try to leave someone's reach entirely. As long as you stay inside their reach, you can run rings around them. That means that in order for a tankier character to protect a more fragile one, they have to stay some distance away from them, or the bad guys can just move past them.
 

tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
How does more mobility lead to less strategy? Especially less than 'charge to target, swing until dead', maybe flank.

Also, the monsters can move too. And they're almost universally as fast as or faster than PCs.
It leads to less strategy because there is no opportunity cost to that movement and there is no mechanical hooks remaining to support anything but close to target>stomp target>repeat.

It's like driving a nascar track at 20mph with no other drivers on the track in a self driving car with no time to beat. Sure it's still a lot of left turns, but those left turns are hardly the same as making a lot of left turns at 200+mph on a crowded track with the clock running

3e had two aspects to it that made melee fights devolve into "stand next to the other guy and wail on each other until one is dead".

1. Full attacks. If you wanted to make all of your attacks, you couldn't move more than 5 ft in a round. Moving more would take a move action, which meant you could only make a standard (single) attack.

2. Attacks of opportunity. If you moved out of a square within an opponent's reach without taking precautions, they'd get a free attack.

In 5e, #1 is completely gone, and #2 is significantly reduced – now you only take an opportunity attack if you try to leave someone's reach entirely. As long as you stay inside their reach, you can run rings around them. That means that in order for a tankier character to protect a more fragile one, they have to stay some distance away from them, or the bad guys can just move past them.
I mentioned those earlier by name, they selectively slowed movement in ways that ultimately increased movement and strategy across the encounter.

You had to deal with mooks and protect your Squishies in the process before getting to the MVP when you couldn't just have everyone charge the most important target. Thanks to the many different trigger conditions that AoOs had over OA almost any opponent could be a credible enough threat to delay that charge at the MVP by a round or two without mooks needing to be beefy or numerous enough to make combat a slog. It all combined so that the close to primary target phase was more than "is it within 30 feet yet this round? If so I move there, if not I move 30 feet closer". The primary target didn't need hundreds of hp to slog through because it could run behind one or two hit mooks who were probably only capable of receiving one hit unless they were already in Melee where they were probably a threat only if ignored to chase the MVP . If those mooks were not in melee their turn often went quick with a 5foot step or full defense. You didn't need 42 goblins protecting the bbeg by flailing about for a 20 just so they could take up enough squares to offer protection without needing to be rough enough that they turn the PCs into a puff of red mist.
 
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TheSword

Legend
Okay?

Look, I actively put in the words 'I personally' this time and that still didn't stop this kind of thing, must less another [Generic Insult] (lol, video games! something more successful culturally than our hobby is an insult!). That's why I don't bother and if someone tries to 'that's just your opinion, man' me again, I'm going to link this sequence.

Edit:
"Why do people like pie?"

"Because it's delicious."

"Well some people have refined tastes and like cakes instead. Also, they aren't stupid and ugly'.

Excellent discourse.
Your justification for removing rest mechanics seems to be that you aren’t fussed about combat challenges.

It’s not an insult to acknowledge someone liked an easier game from a combat point of view or isn’t engaged with difficult combat challenges. If combat challenges aren’t really your thing though I don’t see the point of tinkering with the core combat rules of the game - affecting things for people who do see that as important.

That’s like me saying that a 30 mile per hour speed limit on the roads is fine because I don’t really enjoy driving and I’m not in a rush.

[Edit. Weird that I got Ninja’d by @tetrasodium with a driving analogy 😎]
 

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