How terrible is the multiclass XP penalty?

[Veril]

Because of the 20% XP penalty you will never catch up to the other characters. Take a CR8 encounter - worth 2400 to an 8th level character and 3150 to a 7th level character, after applying 20% penalty you get 2520. As you lost at least 1/2 a level's worth of XP you need at least 10 levels to catch up to the other characters - probably more if you were already part way through 8th rather than only just 8th. (at an average of 4 weeks to level up, that's 40+ weeks i.e. a years play with missed sessions)

Worst comes to worst: Make sure you die in each of the next few combats that happen. Dieing is dead easy to engineer as a player, present yourself as a target and you will get hit, don't let the other players (including the referee) know you are on low HP in the fight. Lets face it, if you engineer the situation to die once more, you will be 2 levels lower than the rest of the party, and significanty weaker than they are, the threats that are suitable for them will be overwhelming to you.
Once you are 2-4 levels behind the rest of the party retire that character and bring in a new character - who will presumably be only 1 level behind the rest of the party, but not have the 20% penalty as you will pick a suitable race.

Tell the referee that you should be keeping your favoured class as it is a 'cultural' trait not a racial trait. Alternativly, tell the referee that the 20% XP penalty is not fun, and this is a game and supposed to be fun.

 

[reveal]

Same as the above. I'd rule the multiclass bonus/penalty arises from cultural affinity, not your size. Xp pen as per original race.

I did that for Eberron. Eberron Halflings are born and raised on the Talenta plains. They ride dinosaurs and are a clanish people. It made no sense to keep their favored class as Rogue, so I house-ruled it to be Barbarian.

Normally, though, I try to keep it by the book. However, if a player comes up with an interesting reason why it should be changed, I'll look into it further.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Tell the referee that you should be keeping your favoured class as it is a 'cultural' trait not a racial trait. Alternativly, tell the referee that the 20% XP penalty is not fun, and this is a game and supposed to be fun.

I disagree. The player took a calculated risk and it didn't pay off, so now he should pay the piper. Taking a risk, failing, and then having the DM wave away the downside is what would be not fun.

PS While we're at it, I thought you lose a level from your highest class?

 

[ARandomGod]

Well, according to RAW the character keeps his mental stats, and adjusts his physical stats. A 'favored race' is a mental stat, and so by RAW the character maintains his old favored race.

Now, ignoring that, the penalty of not playing by RAW and altering the mental stats of the character so as to have the "new" favored class is so extreme (IMO) that you might as well consider the character dead, and reroll.

 

[Li Shenron]

1. What did you do when you were confronted with a 20% XP penalty after reincarnation?

2. How far behind the other PCs will my character be? My DM uses the 3.5 method of calculating XP, so lower level characters get more XP. That will partially offset the 20% penalty. So I'm guessing I'll usually be 1 level behind the others. (I figure I'd fall 2 levels behind if I was getting the same XP as everyone else.)

3. How crappy is it to always be a level behind the other PCs?

You're 7th level, I guess you start from the middle of it. You can make a comparison against another PC who for instance was and still is in the middle of 8th level.

You need 3500+875 Xp to get to level 8th (if 20% is burned, the threshold is 25% higher).

Your friend already got to level 9th slightly before that (4000 Xp), let's see if I can make correct calculation here:

Xp
0 you 7th your friend 8th
4000 him 9th
4375 you 8th
13000 him 10th
14375 you 9th
23000 him 11th
25625 you 10th
34000 him 12th
38125 you 11th
46000 him 13th
51875 you 12th
59000 him 14th
66875 you 13th
73000 him 15th
83125 you 14th
88000 him 16th
100625 you 15th
104000 him 17th
119375 you 16th
121000 him 18th
139000 him 19th
139375 you 17th
158000 him 20th
160625 you 18th
...

Basically you'll be always 1-2 levels behind, or 3 for a very short time at 16th (probably not however).

Will it hurt? Yes, but I have been many times in a group of characters of 2-4 levels range, and as long as they aren't very low level, it's not that the lowest ones are out of the game at all. You're still going to be a very effective member of the group.

I agree however that in the case of reincarnate the xp doesn't make much sense and should not apply.

 

[Len]

Do your calculations take into account that I'll be allocated more XP (before the penalty) because I'm a lower level character? (3.5 method of XP calculation)

Edit: If not, don't bother re-doing the numbers. I'll do a spreadsheet when I get home.

 

[Len]

Well, according to RAW the character keeps his mental stats, and adjusts his physical stats. A 'favored race' is a mental stat, and so by RAW the character maintains his old favored race.

Where is that rule? I don't see "mental stats" mentioned in the spell description.

Now, ignoring that, the penalty of not playing by RAW and altering the mental stats of the character so as to have the "new" favored class is so extreme (IMO) that you might as well consider the character dead, and reroll.

I don't think I want to do that. Especially since we're playing in Eberron and Reincarnate is the only type of resurrection magic we're likely to see for a long time - just ruling it out doesn't seem like a good solution.

 

[Len]

PS While we're at it, I thought you lose a level from your highest class?

Really? I always thought you lose the last level that you gained.

 

[ARandomGod]

Where is that rule? I don't see "mental stats" mentioned in the spell description.

OK, so you have to read it in. These quotes ARE snipped for relevence, but I'm making an effort not to snip anything out of context.

... The magic of the spell creates an entirely new young adult body for the soul to inhabit from the natural elements at hand. ...

A reincarnated creature recalls the majority of its former life and form. It retains any class abilities, feats, or skill ranks it formerly possessed. Its class, base attack bonus, base save bonuses, and hit points are unchanged. Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution scores depend partly on the new body.

Strength, Dex, and Con depend on it's new body. Those states are changed, the physical ones.

First eliminate the subject’s racial adjustments (since it is no longer of his previous race) and then apply the adjustments found below to its remaining ability scores.

Intelligence, wisdom, and charisma are not changed, regardless of what the new race's adjustments on those might be.

It retains any class abilities, feats, or skill ranks it formerly possessed.

A feat and some skill ranks are a racial ability of the "human" race. Other races might also get bonus feats or skill points due to their race. Note that the spell does specifically state that you keep those feats and skill points.

It’s possible for the change in the subject’s ability scores to make it difficult for it to pursue its previous character class. If this is the case, the subject is well advised to become a multiclass character.

This is the only nod to how reincarnation might affect character class. They may no longer be physically suited to their previous class. It says nothing about a new 'favored race' at all. And reading the spell strongly suggests that the previous favored race should not be changed, whether that was the human's "any" or a more specific favored race that might not be good for the new body.

The reincarnated creature gains all abilities associated with its new form, including forms of movement and speeds, natural armor, natural attacks, extraordinary abilities, and the like, but it doesn’t automatically speak the language of the new form.

Another indication that you're not changing anything mentally. The entire spell is based aroung changing the body and not the mind.

 

[was]

We just keep the favored class of the original race of the pc (before the reincarnation).