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OSR Hybrid TSR era clone, does it exist?

Sacrosanct

Legend
I am a big fan of the D&D OSR, but admittedly have only really followed S&W, labyrinth lord, and OSRIC. One thing I’ve noticed is that they seem to emulate a particular edition of TSR era D&D. So is there one that’s a hybrid mix match of B/X, 1e, and 2e? I feel like I’m missing an obvious one
 

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Stormonu

Legend
Castles & Crusades is sort of "what if 3E had been closer to 1E/2E". Perhaps Dungeon Crawl Classics - it seems to be a mix of 1E & B/X, but throws out 2E and adds elements more towards the Weird Tales end of the gaming spectrum.
 

Retreater

Legend
Old School Essentials has recently released the Advanced Fantasy Genre Rules add-on that gives 1E/2E feel to their B/X inspired line - and it's cross-compatible within the same campaign. (With an entire product line on Kickstarter, I think until tomorrow.)
Highly recommend it. I will be porting over one campaign to it in a few weeks.
 



Voadam

Hero
Basic stats are different from AD&D ones. Only going up to +3 bonuses, no percentile strength, bonuses at lower stats for Basic while AD&D has a reverse bell curve for stat bonuses, particularly with percentile strength. OSR games have to basically pick one style or the other of those two.

Basic races do not have stat mods, classes have smaller HD and there is no stat prereqs for classes, while AD&D races have stat mods (generally only +1 -1 though) and multiple class and multiclass options while the classes themselves have slightly higher HD and all sorts of stat requirements.

Mostly AD&D has more options than basic, so usually it is adding AD&D options onto the simpler Basic base rules such as paladins, monks, and assassins and half-orcs and splitting race from class (although I have seen BECMI weapon mastery adapted into AD&D long before the OSR).
 

Markh3rd

Explorer
Fantastic Heroes and Witchery does a great job of blending the different editions and giving you options to make it more like Basic or more towards second edition.
 

Parmandur

Legend
Castles & Crusades is sort of "what if 3E had been closer to 1E/2E". Perhaps Dungeon Crawl Classics - it seems to be a mix of 1E & B/X, but throws out 2E and adds elements more towards the Weird Tales end of the gaming spectrum.
Neither if those are really retroclones, though they are OSR.

Castles & Crusades is very much 3.x slimmed down and focused on old school play and tropes, but it's not really mechanically mimicking one of the older editions.

Dungeon Crawl Classics is very odd: it's also basically 3.x with the math toned down (most things work like 3.x, but you can use monster stat blocks from older Editions if you invert the AC number), but with some entirely new takes (like spells are skill checks, and the Die Chain core mechanic) that put it pretty far out from any edition of D&D.
 

mach1.9pants

Adventurer
It can't be a clone if it is of more than one parent, so really answering the thread title is no. But OP is more nuance and just talks OSR so the closest for me is LL AEC. Old School Essentials with the advanced bits does similar. Which is close to how we played AD&D BitD, BECMI rules with all the AD&D class, monster and magic trappings. I never got my head around AD&D combat!

Maybe Blood and Treasure?
 


Sacrosanct

Legend
Thanks everyone. I know I was totally missing the obvious, although I have a hard time internally rationalizing ascending AC as OSR lol. In my head, when it comes to D&D at least, there is TSR era as OSR, and then WoTC is modern. A very clear line of distinction.

Anyway, what has been tossed around in my head is something like B/X alignment, movement rules, weapon attacks per round (no rate of fire), 1e's aesthetic and atmosphere, race and class separate, and most common rules, and 2e's thief/bard skill progression, and wizard specialization. I'm also thinking of adding/modifying classes so that they get their special abilities staggered as to avoid dead levels whenever possible.
 

Voadam

Hero
Thanks everyone. I know I was totally missing the obvious, although I have a hard time internally rationalizing ascending AC as OSR lol. In my head, when it comes to D&D at least, there is TSR era as OSR, and then WoTC is modern. A very clear line of distinction.

Anyway, what has been tossed around in my head is something like B/X alignment, movement rules, weapon attacks per round (no rate of fire), 1e's aesthetic and atmosphere, race and class separate, and most common rules, and 2e's thief/bard skill progression, and wizard specialization. I'm also thinking of adding/modifying classes so that they get their special abilities staggered as to avoid dead levels whenever possible.
I would then again suggest Labyrinth Lord Advanced Edition Companion as most appropriate. It will give you the BX base with 1e options of race and class separate. You would have to homebrew the 2e specialist wizards and thief skill percentage increases, but that should be easy. OSE advanced options keeps race as class for the 1e race additions. I am not aware of anything adding in 2e stuff to BX on its own out of the box, just straight 2e clones like For Gold & Glory. The 1e adaptations will give you illusionists as their own class which could be used as is and as a base for other 2e specialist types, or you could just apply the 2e specialist features to the 1e adapted MU.
 


Nikosandros

Golden Procrastinator
Thanks everyone. I know I was totally missing the obvious, although I have a hard time internally rationalizing ascending AC as OSR lol. In my head, when it comes to D&D at least, there is TSR era as OSR, and then WoTC is modern. A very clear line of distinction.
Yeah, ascending AC in an OSR game is just wrong...
 



Gold and Glory,from what I heard, is basically DND 2E, with ascending AC IIRC, without DND stamped on the front and no risk of a Lawyer coming down to auto roll Nat 20s crit hit it into oblivion. And it's pretty much compatible with everything 2E.

I myself have been a little curious on trying a bit of OSR, but I'm looking for 2E compatible with 1E ala, what was it, DND 1E Advanced and DND 2E?

Or is that Swords and Wizadry?
 



Ordinarily a great question, but he specifically wants a hybrid of three different editions...
It was argued, a long tume ago, that the 2ed was the blend of some of the idea of late BECMI (with the cyclopedia) and 1ed. I would then go for the 2ed with whatever "complete" book you want for a specific campaign. ;)

Don't get me wrong. I have OSRiC and a few other retro clones, but a mixed edition clone... go for the 2ed.
 

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