D&D 5E I am perfectly fine with WoTC producing D&D 5th Edition

WalterKovacs

First Post
D&D's 3d6-based ability score array is probably the holiest cow in the game--even moreso than character classes. The decision to ditch or retain them speaks volumes.

Ability scores really serve no mechanical function that isn't better served through more selective character resources, like feats and skills. And certainly giving them one number that only represents another number s ridiculous. Why do I need to have an 18 on my character sheet when the actual bonus is +4? I don't.

The ability score/modifier still has some place (although is has been diminished). The odd scores still have a spot because of the point buy system and the level advancement system (plus some stat requirement feats which try to make odd stats palatable). The HP using Constitution stat is new, but earlier editions had ways of using the raw stats as well (such as trying to roll under the stat on a d20 for certain checks).

The trend has moved away from negative stat mods (other than the single 8 you can start with in the 4e point build), but it would still need to get rid of the odd stat stuff, which does have an in game element (you can just slow down the stat increase if it were 1 to 1 in terms of stat modifiers, but that eliminates the element of "do I increase my highest stat now so that I get the ability mod bump in 2 to 4 levels? or do I just round up my 13 to 14 to get the ability mod bump right away?"
 

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Gort

Explorer
"do I increase my highest stat now so that I get the ability mod bump in 2 to 4 levels? or do I just round up my 13 to 14 to get the ability mod bump right away?"

If you're desperate to keep that piddlingly small element of the game, let's just write your strength mod as 4.5 with the understanding that we always round down.
 


interwyrm

First Post
D&D's 3d6-based ability score array is probably the holiest cow in the game--even moreso than character classes. The decision to ditch or retain them speaks volumes.

Ability scores really serve no mechanical function that isn't better served through more selective character resources, like feats and skills. And certainly giving them one number that only represents another number s ridiculous. Why do I need to have an 18 on my character sheet when the actual bonus is +4? I don't.

I'd like to see it stay around for nostalgia... but have it apply only to skills. Combat could certainly use some standardization, and there is legacy support there too... IIRC in 1e/2e, you didn't get any bonus for stats less than 16. It wasn't a -10 then half thing.

In this case, there also wouldn't be a reason to have 'stat bumps'. It might make sense to just do something like "roll a d20, and if it's lower than your stat, you pass the check." Maybe you get a +2 to the ability for being trained in the skill.
 

Zaran

Adventurer
I'm optimistic about the announcement as well. Hopefully they can combine the great development skills put in 4e with the "Love" put into previous editions.
 

I have mixed feelings about this.

I love 4e, I really do. In no previous edition has D&D had such ease of setup for the GM as 4e. I love its flavor and balance and feel. Sure, it's not perfect (I'm looking at you, magic items), but it's still my favorite edition. I'm saddened by the fact that the hundreds of dollars I've poured into 4e should have had a longer-termed investement.

However, I'm quite curious about 5e. What direction will they go in? 4e was a new experiment for D&D, something that they hadn't done before. What will they take from their experience with 4e and put into 5e? How will they change the game to a more ideal aspect? Are they listening to their customers and using that input to make the game better?

I guess I'll have to wait and see. I'm an old-school gamer...been playing since the 70's, and I'll continue to play until they put me in the ground. I'll be buying the new edition, even though I'll be grumbling about it the whole time...
 

Plane Sailing

Astral Admin - Mwahahaha!
D&D's 3d6-based ability score array is probably the holiest cow in the game--even moreso than character classes. The decision to ditch or retain them speaks volumes.

Hey, how long has it been since the rules expected you to roll 3d6 for an attribute ;)
 


Felon

First Post
The ability score/modifier still has some place (although is has been diminished). The odd scores still have a spot because of the point buy system and the level advancement system (plus some stat requirement feats which try to make odd stats palatable). The HP using Constitution stat is new, but earlier editions had ways of using the raw stats as well (such as trying to roll under the stat on a d20 for certain checks).
In government, when someone campaigns to get rid of an inefficient, obsolete system, you'll run into opponents who insist it still has a place because of all the little subsystems that are dependent on it. The obvious response is that an efficient, up-to-date system will either interact better with those subsystems, and some subsystems can be eliminated altogether.
 

Felon

First Post
I'd like to see it stay around for nostalgia... but have it apply only to skills. Combat could certainly use some standardization, and there is legacy support there too... IIRC in 1e/2e, you didn't get any bonus for stats less than 16. It wasn't a -10 then half thing.
Seems to me that if you only apply ability scores to skills, you may as well just make the ability scores into skills. For instance, the FATE RPG doesn't have ability scores. It has a "Might" skill for feats of strength.

I think ability score elimination is a good example of why involving the fans is hardly likely to generate a better game. I have no doubts that if WotC asked fans right now if they should eliminate ability scores, the general sentiment would be "no". Some folks would be motivated by nostalgia, and nostalgia is, frankly, a weak reason to maintain a system. Some people would insist that they serve a vital descriptive role in painting a picture of a character, which is about rational as having an ability score for height and eyee color.

But mainly folks would vote to keep it because they don't see the matter in terms of something better replacing it. They see it in terms of removing it, and can't imagine the void being filled in a better way.

That's particularly true in America, the country that rejected the metric system because it meant making an adjustment. We have a number of cliches in our society for portraying complacency as a virtue. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" and "we'll cross that bridge when we come to it" and "don't count your chickens before they're hatched". All of that just amounts to people not wanting to think ahead or be troubled with adopting new things. Heck, just look at the OP of this thread.
 
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