I can't help but wonder--how many AD&D 1e players ARE there out there?

[Chainsaw Mage]

Every once in awhile people speak of "lost tribes" of AD&D 1e groups, still happily playing 1e after all these years. Dragonsfoot seems well-populated. I can't help but wonder, how many AD&D 1e players ARE there, really? (You can throw in AD&D 2e and D&D B/X if you want as well).

I remember hearing that some industry insider (Monte Cook, perhaps? I'm not sure) had speculated that out-of-print versions of D&D/AD&D were the *second largest* group of RPGs being played (after D&D 3.5, natch). I don't know if anyone has a reference for this, tho--it's just something bouncing in my head that I'm sure I read once.

Any thoughts? How many OOP D&Ders are there, really?

 

[pawsplay]

I know quite a few, including one guy with an entire wall of AD&D products.

 

[hafrogman]

Well, in my personal life (not including the posters on this board I mean). I know precisely zero. Now, we extrapolate the number of people I know (anyone's guess) to the population of the globe (~6 billion iirc) . . . carry the three. . . divide by pi . . . square root of the inverse of the cosine of the arctangent . . .

none.

With a possibly margin of error of ~3 billion.


Honestly? No way to know.

 

[painandgreed]

About two years ago, a friend said she was going to run a 1E game. We grabbed our old books and showed up and played weekly for several months without issue. The books are cheap and ever present at used book stores. Many people know how to play by 1E rules. It is definatly an option I have used.

 

[Henry]

Nobody has a friggin' clue. Best estimates come from sales figures of various companies willing to share, but no one has done a statistically successful poll because, frankly, there's no monetary gain in doing so. All we have are figures like Kenzer's from three years ago saying their Hackmaster PHB sold about 25,000 copies at the time and their DMG sold 15,000 copies, and so forth.

The pool of INTERNET ACTIVE AD&D players is possibly a little easier to find; Just based on message boards, I'm guessing about 1,500 to 5,000 or so. If each one accounts for a group of 2 to 6 players, you're looking at somewhere between 3,000 to 30,000 total players that internet groups account for. Of those, the ones who buy products online are pretty devoted; in other words, if there's something out, they'll scoop it up.

Note this also does not include the current player base, which has no hard figures released, and this does not cover those who play AD&D less than once per month but more than zero times per year; I myself even fall into that category. I'm mainly talking those who play at least once a month. Note finally this is all total anecdotal speculation based on the number of boards I've visited and in some cases just gazed at.

 

[Lanefan]

I can vouch for 10 - the nine players in my dual-party game, plus me. If that makes us a "lost tribe", here we are!

That said, the 1e we play has had 25 years worth of modifications done to it...but it's still vaguely recognizable as 1e, I think.

Lanefan

 

[PapersAndPaychecks]

I think Henry's figures might be a bit low -- perhaps the numbers he gives could be doubled or tripled. (This is based on the distribution figures for my 1e .pdf's which are hosted on Dragonsfoot.)

 

[jdrakeh]

I'd be a player if I could find other people who were interested in it locally (I own all of the essential hardcover, plus a ton of FR 1e material).

 

[Mistwell]

I wonder if there is a viable market for making and selling NEW 1e products?

 

[jdrakeh]

I wonder if there is a viable market for making and selling NEW 1e products?

Sure. Witness Hackmaster's success -- it's a heavily house-ruled version of AD&D (in point of fact, it's actually licensed for that purpose by Kenzer).

 

[silver_wizard]

Although I don't currently participate in any AD&D 2E games either as player or DM, if I were to DM a campaign I would definitely choose AD&D 2E. Similarly, I'd gladly take part in a 2nd edition campaign as a player. Thus, I consider myself a "2nd edition person".

I might even check out Hackmaster...

 

[Cedric]

I currently play 3.5 because the group that adopted me when I moved here plays 3.5. But honeslty...I'm a HUGE fan of 1e and always will be.

I loved the class balance (or lack thereof), the grit, ease of play and use.

I play with a few house rules...I usually waive racial level limitations if a game goes on long enough to warrant it (though, there is an xp penalty for non-human characters progressing beyond their racial level limit of 25%.

Also, I often add a skill system of sorts that is similar to the 3.0/3.5 skillset, but a bit more simplified.

I include 'some' of the Unearthed Arcana material also, but not all of it.

I love 1e...D&D when Arch Mages were someone to be feared (hehe, even though I never played one).

Cedric

 

[Philotomy Jurament]

Apparently there is a viable 1E market. See my post here. Also note that 1E, OSRIC, and C&C products cross-over VERY easily.

There are multiple new/recent 1E (or OSRIC) products:

Goodman Games reprinted the 1E Iron Crypt of the Heretics due to demand.
Pied Piper published Cairn of the Skeleton King, and has a bunch of other modules on the way.
Expeditious Retreat Press started an "Advanced Adventures" line and released Pod Caverns of the Sinister Shroom and three (to date) Old-School Gazette issues.
Ronin Arts started a "First Edition Fantasy" line and has released Into the Mite Lair, with other stuff in the works.
Lamentations of the Flame Princess (that's a mouthful) is taking pre-orders for Insect Shrine of Goblin Hill.

 

[Henry]

I wonder if there is a viable market for making and selling NEW 1e products?

Exactly what OSRIC tries to find out. It's going to be a niche market, regardless, but sustainable for a small company or three if they were to capture a large enough hunk of it.

P&P, so you've seen enough individual DL's to account for up to 15,000 on it?

 

[T. Foster]

My current 1E AD&D group has been meeting every other weekend (give or take) for about 2 and a half years, and currently has 5 members but has had as many as 8 at a time, and a dozen members total over the 2.5 year lifespan. Of this dozen, 1 other (besides me) is active in online oop-D&D fandom, a couple others are registered at dragonsfoot but rarely/never post there, and none of the others are active in online oop-D&D fandom at all.

 

[Akrasia]

... those who play AD&D less than once per month but more than zero times per year; I myself even fall into that category...

I fall into that category as well.

If I were to DM, though, I would take the Rules Cyclopedia (Basic/Expert) version of D&D.

A free OGL-based version of the Basic/Expert D&D, called 'Basic Fantasy Roleplaying', is available for free here: http://basicfantasy.newcenturycomputers.net/

At last count it has been downloaded 1796 times. At least a few people seem interested in it.

 

[Corathon]

I agree with those who said that we have no way of knowing how many people still play 1E or other old versions of D&D. I suspect the answer depends strongly on how you phrase the question.

The two 1E AD&D groups that I DM for have a total of 11 players. One group meets more often than twice a month but not as often as every week, the other meets less frequently. Then there are some old friends that I see (and run a game for) once a year or so, and my PBEM group, so if all of these count that's fifteen 1E players that I know about.

A friend of mine runs a variant 2E game, and a 2E PBEM game also, but I'm not sure how many players he has.

 

[diaglo]

i know of at least 3 OD&D(1974) campaigns just in the Atlanta area.

i'm sure there are ADnDers out there too.

 

[PapersAndPaychecks]

P&P, so you've seen enough individual DL's to account for up to 15,000 on it?

Not on OSRIC, yet; OSRIC's had around 2500 downloads (from unique IP addresses from the K&KA site) in its first three months. Total distribution is much higher, though, because it's on peer-to-peer networks, hosted on other sites, being emailed around etc; it's obviously hard to give an accurate total figure.

My free .pdfs on Dragonsfoot are attracting masses of downloads, though. Even the one I've had up since 2004 still gets about 25 downloads a day.

This tells me that the number of people who visit DF to download their stuff is hugely greater than the number of people who register and post on their forums.

 

[ghul]

1e gamers...

They are among us . . . and their numbers are legion!

--Ghul ;-)