I pose this quandary . . . . .

[Scott DeWar]

I play in living Pathfinder forum. one of my characters is an Elementalist [fire] Wizard with the feats of elemental spell [acid] and signature spell [fireball] (big surprise there, huh?).

woul it be possible for this:

vitriolic blast - fireball with the acid energy type and cast at +2 caster level for being fireball as the base spell?

thoughts?

 

[SteelDraco]

Where are you getting the bonus or bonuses to caster level from? Is this Paizo material, 3PP stuff, or 3.x D&D sources? I'm not seeing where what you've listed would give any bonuses to CL. Fire Elementalist gives extra slots for [fire] spells, and Elemental Spell changes the spell from fire to acid, or allows you to mix it half and half. The only Signature Spell feat I could find (from Super Genius Games's Adventurer's Guide 1) lets you swap prepared spells for that one.

Generally speaking, though, if you get a bonus for the fireball spell itself, it would also apply to that spell modified by a metamagic feat. If you combine acid and fire damage with Elemental Spell, the spell has both those descriptors. If you just use acid, though, it's not a fire spell any more, and wouldn't get bonuses from being a fire spell.

 

[BriarMonkey]

Wasn't there a Signature Spell feat from the 3.x version of the Forgotten Realms campaign guide? I seem to recall the name, but not what it did.

 

[Scott DeWar]

it sounds familiar, but like you, not sure what it did.

 

[Salthorae]

Signature Spell is from both FRCS and PGtF from 3.0 and 3.5

I'm not sure where the +2 Caster Level is coming from on the Fireball in your example though. Elementalist Wizard from APG doesn't give you any bonus to CL that I can see, nor does Signature Spell. Signature spell just allows you to swap out prepared spells for that one.

 

[Scott DeWar]

from the D 20 pathfinder srd (Spell Specialization - Pathfinder_OGC) :

Benefit: Select one spell of a school for which you have taken the Spell Focus feat. Treat your caster level as being two higher for all level-variable effects of the spell.

that would mean a level 5 caster with spell specialization casting fire ball would cast it as 7d6

what i am trying to determine is if a level 7 caster could cast fireball [spell specializaton] [elemental spell - acid] would cast this version of the spell at 9 d6?

note, i mention a level 7 wizard because of the increase in the spell slot for elemental spell - metamagic effect.

 

[Salthorae]

Reading that, it sure does look like it. Since that feat applies to a specific spell, in this case Fireball. With the Elemental spell, you're still casting Fireball, it has just been metamagic'd to use acid and not fire.

So you have two different feats both applying to the spell, and they are both applicable.

In this case you'd get a 9d6 Acid ball that acts like a fireball in that it has a 20' radius burst and reflex save.

 

[Scott DeWar]

thought that was the case.

 

[Squire James]

As written, the rules will allow this. Some ornery DM's might respond to your quandary (I had to get the correction in somewhere, right?) by saying the it isn't a Fireball anymore. In such cases, just dispense with the name change and just call it a Fireball with Elemental Spell (acid) attached to it, and most DM's will let you have it at that point.

Just remember the save DC is still based on a level 3 spell... no you don't get Heighten Spell for free!

 

[Scott DeWar]

As written, the rules will allow this. Some ornery DM's might respond to your quandary (I had to get the correction in somewhere, right?) by saying the it isn't a Fireball anymore. In such cases, just dispense with the name change and just call it a Fireball with Elemental Spell (acid) attached to it, and most DM's will let you have it at that point.

Just remember the save DC is still based on a level 3 spell... no you don't get Heighten Spell for free!

spelling corrected, thank you.

You brought up a very important fact about the character as he has feat: elemental focus witch gives him a +1 on the dc saves vs his fire spells. This means his fireball - altered would get that feat if damage is 50/50, but not if the spell is 100% acid, right? And as you pointed out it is a level 3 spell, not 4; it just takes up the higher slot.