I wish D&D could have been more heroic


Either your players are running very good aligned characters, or ardently neutral characters serving Balance: I'm not sure which.

Something of a mix. Two players are members of the "bloodguard," an elite cadre of warriors in service to the local prince - one is neutral and one is LN. The former is in it to kick tail, the latter is in it for a sense of duty. The other players are all CG, and are pretty much motivated by altruism and the fight against tyranny.
 

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Speaking of heroism...

XP doesn't do it. You shouldn't get rewarded with XP because XP isn't important if you fail, and die. If the PCs do something very heroic, very grand, very risky, they should get a slight bonus, simply to encourage it. Fortune favors the bold and stupid. Check the link.
 
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Re: Re: I wish D&D could have been more heroic

Snoweel said:


(sniggar)

Edit: Damn profanity filter

I believe the word you are looking for is "snicker." And no, it's not a candy bar. :D
 

One of the posters here has one of the top ten greatest .sig's of all time. It starts by some professor quoting astronomical odds against success, and the professor goes on to say something like, "What kinds of people go into battle against those odds?"

The answer given is, "Heroes, professor. Heroes." :D

A hero is someone who goes into a dangerous situation and does the right thing anyway, despite the fact that it means death or bodily harm. This is why we call firefighters and policemen "heroes." It's why we call some military personnel "heroes." (depends on the time and situation, but most of us have had military people in our countries' pasts that fit that bill.) The trapping of D&D as a game, can dilute that somewhat, because in order for someone to be a hero, there must be an element of risk or loss involved. The D&D game's challenge rating is built so that an average encounter will most likely not kill you; you will survive almost all D&D encounters at your challenge level with low to no risk - after all, where is the fun if you are rolling up two characters at every session, JUST to make it through the session?

However, the element of risk for a greater good is what makes games like D&D fun to play. Sure, we have comedy games, we have dark and gritty games like CoC, but most people can only take so much of this in repeated dosages, before getting tired of it. I know that if I GM too many sessions of CoC in a row (say, about 15 to 20 sessions of it), I start to actually depress myself. After all, my creative processes go something along the lines of, "Let's see, what new perverted and mind-numbing horrors can I come up with today to spring on my players?" You need a break, and part of that break is ouright heroism.

Now, heroism requires risk of loss, and the more powerful a threat is that the players can validly defeat or outwit, the greater the thrill of victory. What do players remember more fondly - the time they rescued 20 slaves from the Slave Lords, or the time they suffered a Total Party Kill in the attempt? It matters not if they were captured, got thrown in a cell, and were beaten severely - as long as they get that emotional payoff that comes with ultimate victory. But if they are scripted to do so, then the victory is hollow. It's a fine line, but one that a DM must walk to help create some of the best gaming sessions that are remembered for a long time.

I once had a playing group that played very unwisely, and as a result they lost three of their number to thugs. Two of the three were returned after having a part of their bodies removed as penance, and the third was returned - though only his eyeballs. Two regenerations and a resurrection later, all the PC's remembered that event poignantly, but as a monument to playing more carefully, and they learned from their mistake.
 

Henry said:
One of the posters here has one of the top ten greatest .sig's of all time. It starts by some professor quoting astronomical odds against success, and the professor goes on to say something like, "What kinds of people go into battle against those odds?"

The answer given is, "Heroes, professor. Heroes." :D

Yup. One of my favorite sigs. it belongs to Dagger75-

Prof Sharp: No, no, you can't! You have a 95 percent probability of failure! What sort of people would fight a battle with *those* odds?

Bionic One: Heroes, Professor. Heroes.

Bionic Six
 

Edena -
you keep saying the word "Heroism"
I do not think this word means what you think it means. ;)

In a world that includes the ability to raise from the dead, there is NO SUCH THING as Heroism as you are using the term, in my eyes.

Your use of the word heroism implies a personal cost.
If the only cost a character must pay is money, or time, or reputation, than that is not the same kind of heroism that I think of in fantasy.
 

when did I go away from necromancers? not this centuary LOL nor the last or the next :-)

my two favorite character classes are paladins and necromancers odd mix but I like :-) (third place is firmly placed on fighters).

That said my sunday character would be more what you are use to seeing me do LOL, she is a elven girl that has sold her soul to gain magical powers, to become a wizard (rather instead she became a cleric.. but she isn't aware of the differences as it is a low magic world etc). However since she soul her very being for this power to a demon, she is no longer like an elf, she is shunned by those of light, rejected by all that is holy and sacred etc...

very interesting character, a bit self preserving which is unusual for me ohh well.

and no heroism I will argue is not a matter of stupidity, the ability to sacrifies oneself is not a matter of intelligence or lack thereof it is a personality really.
 

Edena, as usual, I find it very difficult to read more than two or three paragraphs of your posts before my mind starts to wander and I start wondering if there's a point anywhere in there worth going to the trouble to find. You could really benefit from some conciseness!

I'm not sure exactly what you mean. If you're lamenting the lack of heroic stunts that your players are trying, get some new players. If you're lamenting that the system itself discourages over the top heroism, stop smoking that weird plant growing out back and read the rules again. D&D is so over-the-top in terms of potential "heroic" action that it's almost a parody of a fantasy game, a super-hero game, or as hong says, a wuxia movie.
 

Oh, Edena, I'm one tenaciously heroic player. I'm also semi-heroic in real life (getting injured for confronting a particularly abusive individual I won't bring up here), so it's in my blood. I don't believe in stopping, so long as your cause is justified. So, as a player, I don't stop. So, in return, I agree with the majority here that the Player (and DM, don't you guys forget that the DM is equally important in this respect), are important to the cause.

Now, on another note (revives) which stretches slightly off topic, I use the solution Monte provided for in the DMG that seems to often get overlooked: Alternate material components. I have a short list (six items, listed below) that have been used in my campaign setting to raise the dead, and I'll add more when it's time to add more. Each material component can only be used once on a particular individual, and each component can only be found in a limited quantity. This simple little solution makes death and being brought back particularly heroic.

Material Components
A globe of Blessed Adamantine (most adamantine is considered corrupt till it's treated in my campaign setting), only found in a few locations (meteorites, the underdark, the trollforge)
Sacrificing a sacred animal (called Mai-Mai Skuuper), who must agree that the sacrifice is a worthy cause on it's own
The blood of a very powerful and evil creature (Night Troll), however this can only be used on a good or neutral character, and they instantly become the creature's alignment upon resurrection.
Bringing the body to four different rune shrines.
Gathering six life Tarot Cards and using it on the body (minor artifacts).
Sacrificing your own life to bring someone back, whom you must have loved in the eyes of the diety of the cleric casting the spell.
Once, and only once, a character can be resurrected by the avatar of a god-in person.
And soon I'm going to add that frozen flower that only grows in a specific garden in the elemental plane of ice, which must be sacrificed (and they grow so slow, and are so sacred to the people that guard them), which makes it another 'honorable deaths only' revive.

And those are all just examples. I'm sure you all can come up with some great ones that I never would think of, but it's by far a better solution that simply ousting revives, In my humbe opinion.
 
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