D&D 4E Inquiry: How do 4E fans feel about 4E Essentials?

[cavalier973]

I would also add that the essentials “Epic Destinies” were kind of bleah. In core, you balecame a demigod, or an arch mage, or an eternal trickster, and there were descriptions of what happened to your character when the days of adventure finally ended. In the two essentials books, there were the indomitable champion and the destined scion, neither of which talked about the afterlife in any way. It was, “these are the bonuses for an epic tier character”.

essentials classes only had one paragon path option, while the core classes each had three. I like the “Pit Fighter” (for fighters) and the “Combat Veteran” (for warlords).

 

[Garthanos]

Well the Sentinel feat and the Cavalier can still stop enemies in their tracks.

More than one enemy?

 

[Garthanos]

The change from 1 reaction per turn to 1 reaction per turn puts a significant nerf to both of those, however.

Yup I was going to say well as long as there arent too many enemies because in 5e you arent the minion mower and able to affect lots of bad guys type anymore.

 

[Voadam]

I did like the essentials fighter knight's defender's aura over a PH1 fighter's individual mark. Much easier to track at the table. Changing an individual token tracking mechanic to a clear and straightforward aura zone was appreciated.

I preferred the PH1 all martial ranger to the essentials primal variants though. Having really decent martial classes was great in general and having the ranger as a full on effective striker out of the box instead of a 3e style OK light warrior with some magic was fantastic.

 

[Voadam]

The change from 1 reaction per turn to 1 reaction per turn puts a significant nerf to both of those, however.

Was one of those words supposed to be different?

 

[Garthanos]

Was one of those words supposed to be different?

Open ended opportunity attacks (instead of limited by 1 reaction), and ye round vs turn .

 

[Deekin]

Was one of those words supposed to be different?

Yeah, I ment one reaction per round.

In 4e, if 4 orcs rush by your fighter to stab the pointy hat, you get 4 Oppertunity Attacks, and stop them from moving if you are a fighter.

In 5e, if four orcs rush past you to kill the wizard, you get one attack, and unless you are using optional rules, you can't stop them from moving at all.

 

[Garthanos]

In 5e, if four orcs rush past you to kill the wizard, you get one attack, and unless you are using optional rules, you can't stop them from moving at all.

Well if your Cavalier is epic tier he can opportunity attack as many as the level 1 fighter can

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Yes, I was biased in hearing literally the things that were said to me.

"It's a fighter. It's supposed to fight. So not being the best as dealing damage means it isn't a fighter!"

I mean that is an aspect of it, sure, the Ranger wildly out damaged the fighter, and it was weird even for many of us that loved 4e that the fighter couldn’t be built to match the Ranger in a direct manner.

But what you’re “quoting” is something I never saw anyone say, IRL or online. What I did see was that it’s a fighter, and fighters have always been able to focus on killing things quickly, so the fighter should be able to do that, but you have to jump through defender mechanic hoops to do that at all, and you still won’t match the Ranger.

It was a bad choice to lock every class into a role and power source. For me, 4e didn’t have a proper Ranger until essentials added wilderness knacks and primal utility powers, and I built a PHB Ranger with those and ritual casting, and took the Fey Beast Tamer theme because it was less weird to play than the beast master Ranger build, and just flavored my owlbear as a wolf.

For others I knew, the game didn’t have a martial character who focused on rushing in recklessly and killing stuff very effectively, and thus a proper fighter, until Essentials. Because the fighter genuinely should be able to be built for that, or the defender/tank playstyle.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Well if your Cavalier is epic tier he can opportunity attack as many as the level 1 fighter can

Yeah tbh I think Protection fighting style should give you more opportunity attacks that don’t use your reaction, even if it’s limited somehow. Something. I don’t think it needs to be system wide, though.