D&D (2024) Is Oath of the Noble Genie Green, Yellow, or Red?

[Twiggly the Gnome]

That'd be tenet.

A four-tenant oath would be a four-plex. Or a double-occupancy duplex.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

The elemental strikes seem fine to me because you get to choose when you land it, which makes it very flexible. Thus it's fine if some are stronger or weaker, so long as the overall package is good.

Unarmoured defense is fine because they're a Heavy Armour class. If they were a Medium Armour class you'd be right.

It actually kind of awkward for the first 2 levels compared to other Paladins who have the strength for heavy Armour, but you go dex instead, before the first subclass features kick in.

 

[WanderingMystic]

The elemental strikes seem fine to me because you get to choose when you land it, which makes it very flexible. Thus it's fine if some are stronger or weaker, so long as the overall package is good.

Unarmoured defense is fine because they're a Heavy Armour class and they normally start with Chain Mail (AC16). At L1, even if you have a +3 CHA mod (which is the most you're going to have, realistically, as it is a secondary stat after STR or DEX), and have Studded Leather, the best Light armour that even exists in 5E (short of magic armour), you only have AC15. If you eventually, at like, Level 12 or something, got your CHA bonus up to +5 (presumably after getting STR or DEX to 20, and likely using most/all your Feats on ASIs), you still only get it with Studded Leather at best, so would have an AC of 17. Still lower than Full Plate (AC18), which most PCs can afford somewhere between level 3 and level 6 (a looooooong time before 12).

The advantage is that you don't get penalized on Stealth Checks, but that's literally it.

That's the option here - Oath of the Noble Genie Paladins can potentially be decent at Stealth - but here's the thing - it's a bit of a trick, because to actually be good at Stealth, they'd need to be DEX-based, and if they're DEX-based? Guess what! This ability gives them no meaningful benefit! Because you have to choose to add CHA or DEX, and as your DEX is likely higher than your CHA, you'd always go with DEX.

You have to get into multi-class-based min-maxing before this CHA-based unarmoured defense is anything but basically a ribbon ability, and even then its questionable given you need to be L3 to get it.

It is studded leather armor (2) + Dex(3) + cha (3) for a base AC of 18 or 20 with a shield. It is not choose your dex or your cha while wearing light armor so just as good as plate with no penalties and a rather low cost.

Also honestly how often is 2d4 fire or a strength save push and prone going to be something you use over an automatic grapple (restrained)or teleport+ inmmunity to being grapples restrained

 

[WanderingMystic]

It actually kind of awkward for the first 2 levels compared to other Paladins who have the strength for heavy Armour, but you go dex instead, before the first subclass features kick in.

There is no ac difference at levels 1-2 AC 17 (chain mail 15 w shield +2) vs studded leather (12)+ dex(+3)+ shield (+2) = 17. Once you get your sub class you get a +2 or +3 ac bonus from your charisma. This let's you drop the shield and go two weapon fighting. By the time someone can afford plate you could have +1 studded with an 18 dex and 16 cha having taken the dual wield feat giving you 4 attacks on rounds you don't smite, or three when you do.

 

[DrJawaPhD]

Doa: needs to clarify that it takes a free hand. Otherwise can I grapple with Lance?

All similar abilities in the PHB don't mention requiring a free hand, this requirement is specified across the board in the rules for Grappling itself, so there is no need to repeat it every time.

More interesting to me though is that on my first reading without having put any thought into it, I was envisioning this ability as invoking the ground itself to reach up and grapple the enemy. It would be useless for many Paladins if a) doesn't work with sword/shield due to requiring a free hand, and b) doesn't work well with 10' reach weapons due to being out of range to stay grappled.

I'm wondering which way WotC intended it to be

Aura: maybe slightly too good. Possibly a bonus action to switch? Could be fine as is.

Giving your entire party resistance to an elemental damage type (on top of higher saving throw for half damage) seems really strong, but is it that strong when you need to clump up to gain the resistance? In many (most?) cases you could better damage reduction by just spreading out and not being hit.

Requiring a bonus action to switch elements isn't a bad restriction but I'm not sure how much it matters since you can usually predict the predominant damage type (if there is one) before combat starts based on what you're fighting.

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

I really liked this subclass. I think it could use a few changes, but overall it's solid. The AC can definitely get crazy high with the right build and the lore that they serve all 4 genie types is a little weird, but not a big deal. I wasn't a fan of the last two Paladin subclasses WotC came out with (The Watchers, Glory), so it's nice that they ended up making one I think is cool.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

It actually kind of awkward for the first 2 levels compared to other Paladins who have the strength for heavy Armour, but you go dex instead, before the first subclass features kick in.

It means you need to choose "gold" for your starting gear, since the last thing you want is chainmail and a longsword, but you should have some dosh left over from buying your studded leather and scimitar. Staring AC probably 15 rather than 16.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I really liked this subclass. I think it could use a few changes, but overall it's solid. The AC can definitely get crazy high with the right build and the lore that they serve all 4 genie types is a little weird, but not a big deal. I haven't been a fan of the last two Paladin subclasses WotC came out with (The Watchers, Glory), so it's nice that they ended up making one I think is cool.

I felt the Oath of Glory should have got to add their charisma to AC when unarmoured, because what is more glorious than running into battle naked?

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I felt the Oath of Glory should have got to add their charisma to AC when unarmoured, because what is more glorious than running into battle naked?

AC = 10 + dex + cha and an optional shield would be good enough.

Or: only +cha when wearing light armor (not when using no armor.) and no shields. That at least doesn't let it stack with unarmed defenses.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

It is studded leather armor (2) + Dex(3) + cha (3) for a base AC of 18 or 20 with a shield. It is not choose your dex or your cha while wearing light armor so just as good as plate with no penalties and a rather low cost.

I don't think that's the intention. They just need to clarify the wording so it's not misinterpreted.

Also honestly how often is 2d4 fire or a strength save push and prone going to be something you use over an automatic grapple (restrained)or teleport+ inmmunity to being grapples restrained.

There will 100% be times when more damage or pushing several enemies away, potentially even off cliffs or the like is better than those. The damage value isn't large, but that's fine. That stops it being the default option.