D&D 5E Is the sleep spell d&d 5e too powerful

[Jasondd]

Don't saves already take that into account? Or are you talking about adding some other factor? Because, if so, I think players will find that way too fiddly!

Not sure I understand but the sleep spell as is has no saving throw.

 

[Mort]

Not sure I understand but the sleep spell as is has no saving throw.

You reiterated a couple of times that the more powerful the wizard, the harder to resist. That's implied in the saving throw mechanic - just seemed like you wanted to add another level to that.

 

[Jasondd]

The problem, as others have stated, is that a wizard powerful enough to have a high resist DC wouldn't be wasting his time on a 1st level spell with a low hit point threshold and chance to completely resist it. But yes, try it out in play, that's the best way to see how it unfolds.

This is exactly my point, if there is no save he will use it most definitely (1st level spell, very low cost at high level). Imagine you are fighting a powerful NPC (human, no resistance) and he becomes moderately wounded, as a first level slot you could take him down (no save) and using a higher level slot (easy). Or else you need to always have you NPC'S have some sort of resistance or else, bye bye

 

[Tony Vargas]

Cool. They removed that from all other editions then? It sounds vaguely familiar.

Looks like it was re-named and re-jiggered as Circle of Death in 3e.

...and kept that name in 5e, where it's 'just' a huge (60'r) necrotic damage AE.

 

[Jasondd]

You reiterated a couple of times that the more powerful the wizard, the harder to resist. That's implied in the saving throw mechanic - just seemed like you wanted to add another level to that.

Sorry if I was unclear, trying to respond to multiple people. Just adding a save vs spell casting ability.

 

[Dausuul]

I think that 1st level is equivalent to CR 1

You can think it, but you're wrong. Absurdly, hilariously wrong. Actually go and look at the stats for a CR 1 monster.

 

[PsyzhranV2]

 

[Jasondd]

You can think it, but you're wrong. Absurdly, hilariously wrong. Actually go and look at the stats for a CR 1 monster.

Maybe I'm wrong and it's 1/4 or 1/2, fine. It still doesn't change the point.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Good example but others could wake up and sleep species that you must "slap" him awake. Someone must wake you up. So again have to give it to the mage with sleep.

The rogue can do it at will, and has a chance in hell against anyone who wakes up. And can actually be stealthy effectively. In fact, since sleep=disadvantage on perception=-5 on passive perception, and the rogue will usually have Expertise Stealth, there is almost no chance of the rogue accidentally waking anyone up.

 

[Jasondd]

The rogue can do it at will, and has a chance in hell against anyone who wakes up. And can actually be stealthy effectively. In fact, since sleep=disadvantage on perception=-5 on passive perception, and the rogue will usually have Expertise Stealth, there is almost no chance of the rogue accidentally waking anyone up.

Ok but the rogue has to succeed his checks and the death screams could wake someone up