Magic Missile

[UngeheuerLich]

oh, and actually MM has its own rules that overwrite specifics:

MM counts as ranged basic attack. Ok, actually it states that it can be used as such, but with this little errata which could have made it into the essential book, problems are solved...

 

[Gradine]

Monks using the movement technique of Full Discipline powers are making attacks by that definition... the power has an attack line, and a target line.

Wardens shifting into a Form are attacking, but actually using the Form's attack is not an attack because it isn't "the initial use."

And Warlord's are now attacking their allies when they use quite a lot of powers.

Eeeee, that FAQ.... causes a lot more problems then it solved.

Least they didn't say "all attacks" follow those rules. There are some utility powers that would be broken. Though I guess that is debatable. If you take that as the entire definition of an attack (is an attack power, has a target line and/or an attack line > is an attack) then Class Features, Racials, and Utilities are never attacks. FAQ takes precedence over what the books say.

Again, you are looking far too literally at the interpretation as written. With a such a mindset, it would be possible to twist anything WotC could put out into something that is not at all what they intended. By the definition you have gleaned the Dragonborn's breath power no longer counts as an attack, and this is obviously not RAW, let alone RAI.

The description of the Warden's Form attacks explicitly calls them attacks. Without, as far as I can find, exception. Just because something targets an ally does not make it an attack; this is sheer silliness. I couldn't find a single Warlord non-utility power that targets an ally anyway (didn't go through the MPs, admittedly). There are a grand total of two Monk movement techniques that include enemies as targets, which yes could potentially lead to some wonkiness if not properly adjudicated by the DM.

And therein in lies the rub. There's simply too much to 4e at this point that any single problem can be simply solved by a few lines in a FAQ or an errata. There will be no simple one sentence definition for the word "attack" that will properly work for everything that should rightfully be considered an attack and leave out everything that rightfully shouldn't. Cling too hard to the semantics, and dig too deep into the rules, and inevitably something will be "broken." These problems will inevitably have to be fixed at the table. For the sake of every gamer at every table, I should hope that common sense will always triumph.

 

[KarinsDad]

Also, class features are now not attacks.

Class features like Warden's Fury? Not an attack.


Course, the FAQ answer might just be answering the specific Magic Missile question in a general way and may be a subset of all attacks.

 

[Gradine]

This post was a bit too snippy, and the argument is futile anyway. WotC is never going to be able to provide an all-inclusive, easy to understand answer, and any attempt they make is going to be met by rules lawyers picking it apart and finding obvious exceptions. There's absolutely no sense in getting bogged down in semantics anymore.

 

[keterys]

Also, class features are now not attacks.

Class features like Warden's Fury? Not an attack.


Course, the FAQ answer might just be answering the specific Magic Missile question in a general way and may be a subset of all attacks.

Yes, it is not making a definition for all attacks, just adding to it. So, Dispel Magic, Warden's Fury, still attacks.

 

[Oldtimer]

Apparently the 1977 Dungeons & Dragons (2nd version) Basic Set (blue box) (levels 1–3) was blue. Ahh, here's a link. I remember the book, but I don't remember the box. Then again, it came out before I was born.

That's the Holmes edition. The rulebook was certainly (monochrome) blue, but the box cover was all sorts of colors. The dragon was red and the background was kind of blue-grey. I never called it "the blue box" myself, just Basic Set.

I suppose I should find the book and check MM there as well... or open another cold beer...

Decisions, decisions.

 

[Camelot]

So, did you check out the Essentials_Wizard yet? Besides letting us know once again that Essentials is not a new edition, it shows us something about the new magic missile. All e-wizards have it, in addition to two other at-wills. Which means human e-wizards get four at-will attacks at level 1. Think they're going to rules update the PH?

 

[DEFCON 1]

Probably not, because Wizards get Rituals for free.

 

[MrMyth]

Monks using the movement technique of Full Discipline powers are making attacks by that definition... the power has an attack line, and a target line.

Wardens shifting into a Form are attacking, but actually using the Form's attack is not an attack because it isn't "the initial use."

And Warlord's are now attacking their allies when they use quite a lot of powers.

Eeeee, that FAQ.... causes a lot more problems then it solved.

Hmm. I think the problem would more be with the powers that combine several different actions in one entry. There are already weird things that come from that - the approach by most people is to simply treat the different elements as seperate, and only refer to the relevant part actually being used.

 

[MrMyth]

Probably not, because Wizards get Rituals for free.

I suspect the Essentials post-level 1 features (Expert Mage, Master Mage, etc) will be the equivalent of rituals, just focused on the appropriate school specialty.

I expect that when Essentials hits, there will be Errata giving Magic Missile to all current Wizards for free.