Magical missile weapons and DR

[mmu1]

I've never been a particularly big fan of the idea that a +1 bow doesn't do anything to overcome damage resistance unless you also have +1 arrows - in particular in light of the fact that some bows (of shock, flaming, etc.) clearly CAN imbue arrows with special properties.

What I've been considering doing is allowing all magical missile weapons - bows, crossbows, etc. overcome damage resistance even when firing mundane projectiles, while at the same time ruling that the enchantment bonuses on a magical missile weapon and a magical projectile don't stack, thus requiring an archer to have either a magical bow or magical missiles, not both.

Now, I don't think this is likley to be a problem at low to mid levels - especially considering that an archer can use a might bow... but I've never seen anyone play a dedicated missile weapon user in an exteneded campaign... Can anyone who's seen an archer in play over a long period of time, or at high levels, commment on how they think this might work out over a character's career? Is the inablity to stack bow enhancement with arrow enhancement hurt a character significantly at higher levels, for example?

 

[Crothian]

This won't really hurt the archer. I had a 14th level Ranger, dedicated archer in my game. He took out 14 low level fighters with one shot each in a row. Granted, he rolled well on damage, but it was impressive (but the 15th low level fighter took 5 arrows to fall, it was wierd).

Misssile weapons have always held an advantage over melee for the fact that arrows stack with bows. Swords, you can get +5, bows and arrows can get +5 a piece, a total of +10.

 

[Rackhir]

Rackhir's Standard Answer to Why Bow and Arrow Bonus Stacking is Not a Bad Thing (c)

Yes, the ability to stack the damage and to hit bonuses is a nice feature, but let's look at some of the things you give up or can't do in exchange for that.

1) Numerous feat and prestige class skills that do NOT apply and do not have any counterparts in applicable Missile feats.

Lets look at one in particular for a moment, Power attack.

I have a 12th level archer character. Has a buffed attack bonus of 22/22/17/12. So basically he does not miss against most opponents except on an automatic miss. A melee character with Power Attack (one of THE basic feats for any melee combat characters) can convert that excess attack bonus into damage with Power Attack. That can easily translate into another 5 points of damage per hit or more depending on how lucky you are feeling. I have pretty much stopped looking for ways to increase his attack bonus as a result and are scrounging for ways to increase his damage. There aren't a lot out there.

Whirlwind attack, Cleave/Great Cleave, Combat Reflexes (multiple AoOs) all do not work with missile weapons and have no counterpart in feats for missile weapons (though there is one feat for Arcane Archers that gives an attack against multiple opponents). There are many, many more.

Spring Attack grants immunity to AoOs while doing the move-attack-move combo. Shot on the Run does not.

Missile weapons do not threaten an area. This means numerous feats involving AoOs are useless since you don't threaten opponents.

Unless you are an Order of the Bow Initiate, you draw an AoO when ever you fire the bow with in the threat range of an enemy.

2) Strength bonuses cap out at +4 on Mighty Composite bows. For melee weapons there is no cap and a "poor" Two-handed-sword user gets a x1.5 Str bonus multiplier. On a 12th level character you could easily see a strength of up to about 30 when fully buffed (22 str, barbarian raging with bulls strength on), for a two handed weapon str damage bonus of +15. Remember that also applies to hit.

3) Many of the bonuses to hit and damage for missile weapons do not apply at ranges greater than 30'. By some strange coincidence, this is also a standard move for most creatures. In other words, an archer at optimal range is always going to be within attack range of most creatures.

4) Rate of fire - When my archer is hasted he's geting 5 attacks a round. That means he can empty a single casting of GMW (50 arrows) in 10 rounds of combat (or in other words 1 to 2 combats).

5) Feats required - If you want to have a character who is decent at being an archer, you need a minimum of about 3 feats - Precise Shot, Point blank Shot, Rapid Shot. No problem if you are a fighter, if you're a paladin, ranger, barbarian. You've got some tough choices.

I could go on, for example there are a number of prestige classes which are either useless (melee oriented abilities) or effectively can't be taken by archery oriented characters.

Mind you none of this is to complain that Archers suck or got nerfed. My character is one of the most lethal and deadly characters in the campaign.
But there are a LARGE number of limitations and restrictions on being an archer. Getting to stack the bonuses is NOT a hideous advantage and should not be taken away.

Remember buffing the bow and the arrows is two 3rd level spells a day (out of maybe 5-6) and if you don't have the mage or cleric (or couldn't talk them into casting it for you that day) you are helpless against DR creatures.