Melee Weapon Mastery

[HeapThaumaturgist]

Well, it has a BAB requirement of +8, so it's only really available at Fighter8 or Fighter4/Barbarian5, etc.

I do think it should have a Fighter Level 8th requirement, though, like Specialization.

But at 8th level, I do think an additional +2 damage is balanced. It's a feat chain ... +1 attack, +1 attack and +2 damage ... +3 attack and +4 damage ... I think by 8-9th level it's in line with other abilities like Spring Attack.

As I said, though, I really would have preferred to see it with a Fighter Level requirement. It seems like the designers are really skittish about putting that text in there and instead try to skirt around it by giving things to the Fighter "earlier" than other characters. I like Fighter reqs because it makes those feats a sort of "adjustable class ability" ... ONLY the Fighter would get it, but they wouldn't be forced into it.

--fje

 

[comrade raoul]

Well, it has a BAB requirement of +8, so it's only really available at Fighter8 or Fighter4/Barbarian5, etc.

I do think it should have a Fighter Level 8th requirement, though, like Specialization.

This I'd totally buy, though I'm not sure what that would do to Greater Focus/Specialization, which might seem a little redundant afterwards.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Ari, is there any chance that you have talked with David Noonan to see if this was his intent when he wrote the feat?

The table and flavor text really point in the direction that the feat simply intended to spread the focus + spec bonuses around to all weapons of the same type, but the text seems to contradict that. At this point, I'm wondering what the intent was and not the way the feat actually works.

Thanks!

I don't speak to Dave often; it's unlikely to happen any time soon unless we end up working on a gig together. I'll ask him if the opportunity arises, but honestly, I don't expect it in the near future.

But honestly, I don't feel the feat makes any sense at all if it doesn't stack. It strikes me as truly bizarre and counter-intuitive to take a character who has constantly focused on Weapon X, and all of a sudden have a whole bunch of weapons improve without also improving X, and then later on have new feats which once again make him better with X. It's much more sensical, to me, to assume that the intent was that X constantly remain ahead of other options.

 

[Mouseferatu]

I do agree, however, that the feat really ought to have a fighter level prereq.

 

[starwed]

He'll be hitting 15th soon and getting a new feat and I was going to suggest Slashing Flurry.

Man, you really do hate him...

I think someone ran some numbers, and it's not worth using unless you've already got a really really good chance of hitting.

 

[Legildur]

I like the way they tried to improve the lot for fighters (leading all the way to Weapon Supremacy at Ftr18) in the PHBII.

But, like many others here, I thought that it should have a Ftr8 prerequisite.

My other beef is that the feat should have come AFTER Greater Weapon Focus/Specialisation as you now get a better result than those two feats for the cost of only a single feat AND you don't need any more than Ftr4 (BAB +8) to qualify (rather than Ftr12). It undermines the existing feats.

As it stands, there are now 3 weapon specific (and dare I say it, fighter specific) feats competing for the Ftr8 bonus feat slot . These are Greater Weapon Focus, Improved Critical, and Melee/Ranged Weapon Mastery. I believe that GWF should have been available at 6th, leaving IC at 8th, GWS at 10th and MWM at 12th. That would have been a more sound progression and would give a weapon dedicated fighter something to buy at each bonus feat level that would otherwise be unavailable to other PCs.

 

[HeapThaumaturgist]

Man, you really do hate him...

I think someone ran some numbers, and it's not worth using unless you've already got a really really good chance of hitting.

Well, with the Weapon Mastery in there he currently hits at:

+24/19/14

That would let him move and take a Standard Attack at 19/14

Or take a full attack at 19/19/14/9 ... granted that's a little blah.

But this is pre-buff. We're usually quite heavily buffed before combat, to the tune of another +3-4 on attack rolls. So it wouldn't be unusual for him to then have a 22/22/17/12 full attack. On something large with low AC, that would be a pretty good throwdown.

Oddly, pre-buff my character hits at 19/14/9 ... Barbarian/Cleric, so my BAB is lower than his, and my base Str. I then buff with Righteous Might and Smite (+4/+14) and then dump bonus into power attack until I'm striking at +20 ... I just like the ease of math, honestly, in adding +20 to the d20 roll, so I just dump bonus into PA until I get there. But it's usually just the one attack ... move then smite ... so I don't notice the poor attack bonus on the back-end.

More I was thinking that the Standard Attack would be useful for him. He has Winged Boots and often zooms around with a 60' fly speed in combat. He has a Holy Mage-Bane weapon and an additional +1d6 damage to creatures with Spells or SLAs, so he would get in more physical melee attacks to strap that +5d6 damage in there (at this level it's getting pretty rare to meet something without at least an SLA). If he can move and still get two attacks in, that would be 2d10+24+10d6 potential damage after a move action. Not at all shabby.

--fje

 

[pawsplay]

The big problem with the feat is that both it and GWF are available at 8th level... and MWM is the better choice, even if you want to specialize in a particular weapon. Oopsie!

 

[Endur]

I do not allow melee weapon mastery to stack with weapon focus and specialization. The intent is to spread the bonuses around to a whole category of weapons.

 

[Mouseferatu]

I do not allow melee weapon mastery to stack with weapon focus and specialization. The intent is to spread the bonuses around to a whole category of weapons.

Really? Can you show me where it says that? As I read the feat, the "intent" is ambiguous at best, and the effect is to add bonuses that, by all the rules, do indeed stack.