D&D 5E Misty Step in manacles?

[Lanliss]

Honestly I hadn't noticed that it only has a verbal component that does change things a bit and will require a rethink, however I never said anything about certain materials stopping it nor do I think would manacles (provided they aren't the full hand encompassing type) prevent a somatic portion of a spell being used. Nowhere that I can find does it say spells require your hands to be in front of you and imho if it did you would have a lot of trouble casting a lot of the old spells (and without knowing the full current spell list) and a lot of the new ones that deal with giving bonuses to NPC interaction "Your a friend right now but I just saw you wiggle your fingers at me and I've never seen you before in my life". IIRC in old editions the person became best friends.

At the end of the day how people see spellcasters, magic, and spells in the world changes what people think they can do. I had a conversation with a friend a few years back that really put it in perspective for me. Long story short he believed characters are born heroes while I believe characters become heroes. Magic could very well be put in that same light.

As an aside your pointing out that the spells doesn't say anything about manacles stopping teleportation it also doesn't say anything about being aloud to choose what you bring or that it doesn't bring certain things. It's two line descriptor really leaves it completely open to interpretation and assuming that it does what you want because of something unrelated (vocal component only) doesn't really support that.

I am fully ok with it leaving behind all of your clothes as well as the manacles, maybe even allow my players to pick. Keep everything, or keep nothing. My point before was simply that the Manacles being attached to a wall should have no effect on your ability to teleport, because it is teleporting and not moving really fast.

As far as Somatic components, I generally consider them a less flashy version of the Doctor Strange style casting, maybe more symmetric wrist movements instead of full arm movements. I am actually working on a "Dual wielding" style of casting, so a player can choose "Single Circle", as a power house/two handed style, which uses both hands in a single circle, or "Twin circle" which is weaker, but faster. This would allow things like casting two separate 1st level spells in the same turn. It is a very young idea, but I like adding more depth of choice to classes. All of that aside, a number of people I see on these forums considers Manacles a way to stop Somatic components, and it might even be RAW (Not that it is important outside of helping people understand RAW).

 

[Obeliske]

I am fully ok with it leaving behind all of your clothes as well as the manacles, maybe even allow my players to pick. Keep everything, or keep nothing. My point before was simply that the Manacles being attached to a wall should have no effect on your ability to teleport, because it is teleporting and not moving really fast.

As far as Somatic components, I generally consider them a less flashy version of the Doctor Strange style casting, maybe more symmetric wrist movements instead of full arm movements. I am actually working on a "Dual wielding" style of casting, so a player can choose "Single Circle", as a power house/two handed style, which uses both hands in a single circle, or "Twin circle" which is weaker, but faster. This would allow things like casting two separate 1st level spells in the same turn. It is a very young idea, but I like adding more depth of choice to classes. All of that aside, a number of people I see on these forums considers Manacles a way to stop Somatic components, and it might even be RAW (Not that it is important outside of helping people understand RAW).

There is an old metamagic that does this I think it was called twincasting or something like that

We see differences in how casting so done for sure but other then full hand manacles why would manacles prevent somatic components then but manacles are rarely listed as being the full hand style as well. With that in mind why would the spell being somatic only have any bearing on what the teleport does?

Logically the spell takes along your clothing weapons and etc so it would take the manacles if the manacles are attached to the wall shouldn't it take the wall and by extension the building planet at etc. Where do you draw the line? I would simply state it doesn't work that way before they cast the spell. Their character would know that in game even if they out of game do not. I believe this spell is more of a utility spell something to avoid having the 8-10 str caster type character from dieing to a 20 foot climb. I feel that if they had intended it to be more they would have said so. It doesn't make sense to me that a level 3 character can essentially ignore (by casting this bonus action spell) grappled, prone, and restrained which are in my opinion probably the most used conditions in the game.

At this point I feel like were just not going to see eye to eye on this and the OP's question has been answered. I feel like it's simply a difference in DMing styles and to each his own

 

[Lanliss]

There is an old metamagic that does this I think it was called twincasting or something like that

We see differences in how casting so done for sure but other then full hand manacles why would manacles prevent somatic components then but manacles are rarely listed as being the full hand style as well. With that in mind why would the spell being somatic only have any bearing on what the teleport does?

Logically the spell takes along your clothing weapons and etc so it would take the manacles if the manacles are attached to the wall shouldn't it take the wall and by extension the building planet at etc. Where do you draw the line? I would simply state it doesn't work that way before they cast the spell. Their character would know that in game even if they out of game do not. I believe this spell is more of a utility spell something to avoid having the 8-10 str caster type character from dieing to a 20 foot climb. I feel that if they had intended it to be more they would have said so. It doesn't make sense to me that a level 3 character can essentially ignore (by casting this bonus action spell) grappled, prone, and restrained which are in my opinion probably the most used conditions in the game.

At this point I feel like were just not going to see eye to eye on this and the OP's question has been answered. I feel like it's simply a difference in DMing styles and to each his own

On the contrary, I think I might be misunderstanding you. I previously thought you were saying that, if someone were manacled to a wall, their misty step would fail to function at all. If that was not your stance, I apologize, because that was what I was arguing against. If it was your stance, than I can agree to disagree.

As for somatic vs. Manacles, Some people consider casting to require arm movement, or intricate gestures. If you haven't watched the recent Doctor Strange, you could probably just find a gif of someone casting to get an idea of what I mean. Others consider the S component much more subtle, more like playing a phantom piano with only 5 keys, or fingering the frets of a guitar that moves on it's own, making it nothing more than wrist and finger movements. The rule for Somatic components just says "Free use of one hand". This can be taken in a few ways, the two relevant ones being "free use of one hand", "Free use" here meaning completely unencumbered. The other is "Free use of one hand", meaning that as long as you can move the fingers on at least one hand, you can meet the S requirement for a spell. I lean more towards the second, personally, but can see the justification for the first.

 

[Quixote]

So, I'm imagining my wizard attempting to misty step out of manages. My DM says, "The manacles go with you, because they're supported by you, so they're effectively your equipment."
After giving him the hairy eyeball, I respond, "Fine, I rest the manacles on the table, so I'm not supporting them. In fact, with a little bit of work, I am sure I could make it so I'm not even touching them. Then I teleport." He replies, "No. If they were attached to the wall, they wouldn't teleport with you, but they aren't."
Rolling my eyes dramatically, I say, "OK. I have a rope. I'll tie the manacles down. Wait! You are going to say the rope doesn't ATTACH them to the wall. I GLUE each wristlet to the wall! NOW do they teleport with me?"
Him: "OK! If you want to teleport out of the manacles, you have to teleport without ANY equipment." Me: "You can't be serious..."

My actual conversation about this was whether I could carry another person (a gnome) while I misty step. The DM said "The spell says 'you', not 'you and everything you're carrying' and there's no way, however intimate you are, that the gnome can be part of 'you'."

 

[jaelis]

My actual conversation about this was whether I could carry another person (a gnome) while I misty step. The DM said "The spell says 'you', not 'you and everything you're carrying' and there's no way, however intimate you are, that the gnome can be part of 'you'."

The game generally treats objects differently from creatures. It would be reasonable to let you carry a dead gnome even if you couldn't carry a live one. See for instance https://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/04/1...nscious-target-with-you-using-dimension-door/

Q: Can you take a unconscious target with you using dimension door?
A: Only a willing creature can travel with you via dimension door. You can't give consent when you're unconscious.
Q: Seems odd, what's the difference between an unconscious creature and an object? Just need to be small enough to be carried?
A: Think of it this way: a spell that requires a willing target is partially fueled by that person's will.

 

[AntiStateQuixote]

So, I'm imagining my wizard attempting to misty step out of manages. My DM says, "The manacles go with you, because they're supported by you, so they're effectively your equipment."
After giving him the hairy eyeball, I respond, "Fine, I rest the manacles on the table, so I'm not supporting them. In fact, with a little bit of work, I am sure I could make it so I'm not even touching them. Then I teleport." He replies, "No. If they were attached to the wall, they wouldn't teleport with you, but they aren't."
Rolling my eyes dramatically, I say, "OK. I have a rope. I'll tie the manacles down. Wait! You are going to say the rope doesn't ATTACH them to the wall. I GLUE each wristlet to the wall! NOW do they teleport with me?"
Him: "OK! If you want to teleport out of the manacles, you have to teleport without ANY equipment." Me: "You can't be serious..."

My actual conversation about this was whether I could carry another person (a gnome) while I misty step. The DM said "The spell says 'you', not 'you and everything you're carrying' and there's no way, however intimate you are, that the gnome can be part of 'you'."

Your DM is cockblocking you and making you ask permission to have fun. Tell him, "No, that's not the game I want to play," and point him to this thread.

 

[Oofta]

Your DM is cockblocking you and making you ask permission to have fun. Tell him, "No, that's not the game I want to play," and point him to this thread.

After which the DM is free to say "well, this is the game I'm playing" while pointing to the door.

 

[Ristamar]

The game generally treats objects differently from creatures. It would be reasonable to let you carry a dead gnome even if you couldn't carry a live one. See for instance https://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/04/1...nscious-target-with-you-using-dimension-door/

The roped/glued/bolted issue is still an interesting question that isn't addressed by that Sage Advice. At what point does an object cease being a part of your carried equipment? Does the attachment of a rope or chain or some form of adhesive suddenly make it grounded from teleportation? Is it restricted by size or weight or resistance to being moved by your person? What are the breakpoints for those parameters?

My inclination would be to leave it to the casters choice, but he must be able to [-]carry the object or objects in question along with his current gear and still have a movement speed greater than 0[/-] fit the object(s) inside a 10-foot cube (per the Teleport spell restriction) in order to bring something with him as part of Misty Step.

 

[Krachek]

I like this question because one of the answers is 'Depend on the DM'.
And that answer make people mad!

 

[Oofta]

There are always going to be edge cases. I assume that if you had a pair of manacles in your backpack they would misty step with you. If you were holding them in your hand they would go. Latch them on to your wrists? Not really any different IMHO.

But let's turn this around a little bit. Let's say you were holding on to one end of a pair of manacles and someone is holding on the the other end? What if you're manacled together? What happens when you misty step? What if the manacles are the only thing holding the other individual from falling into a pit. You are effectively carrying the other person, what happens if you misty step then? If the positions were reversed? What if you're both falling to your doom, neither person holding the other?

This is one of the many reasons we have a DM and not computer code, so they can make those kind of judgement calls. Sometimes there is no one true answer.