OSR Must OSR = Deadly?

EzekielRaiden

Follower of the Way
I ask the other question: must death be unheard of in 5e?

I would like some middle ground but don’t know the best rules for that (that could be used with 5e that is).
In my experience, it isn't unheard-of at all. I have personally had multiple characters die. It soured me rather a lot on the early levelling experience.
 

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Games back in the day were deadlier than they are now - but OSR games are frequently much deadlier than most games they are based on because if it's one of the things people miss they are going to turn it up to 11 as that was a part they enjoyed.

Hirelings were some of the most important rules in the game - and yes they were used as meat shields, but they also took a share of the risk and got a share of the loot. And it's a lot easier for four PCs with a dozen hirelings with 1d6 weapons to take down an ogre or three lizardmen in 1-2 rounds than it is for four PCs without the hirelings - and because you have so much total damage you kill the monsters faster and thus take far less damage between you. This is why the wizard having only one spell was fine - in the game of Fantasy naughty word Vietnam they were the guy carrying around a large radio that could call down an airstrike 1/day, but only had a sidearm. And what they did the rest of the time was played lance corporal for the NPC privates.

The game, of course, shifted round 4th or 5th level because although hirelings might get a half-share of the loot they didn't level up (unless a PC died in which case your replacement PC was frequently the second hireling from the left, so in universe some of the hirelings went on to great things). By that point the monsters got just that bit too deadly for your standard hireling and although quantity has a quality all of its own they weren't going, and 4th or 5th to 9th level used the nuclear adventuring party we are all familiar with. From memory the brown box has more pages of rules to do with hirelings than combat.

As for @Retreater asking for rules light, fun, and fast paced, come to the dark side, we have cookies. Depending on what you are looking for Blades in the Dark, Apocalypse World, or Fate could be what you are after.
 

Marc_C

Solitary Role Playing
What gives now? Is the entire OSR movement just for bragging rights for grognards? Is there some in-between system (between OSR and 5e) that is rules-lite, fun, and fast-paced?

B/X was slow paced and deadly. We had to create many house rules. As the DM I had to fudge the damage dice often despite having players who understood combat tactics and were war-gamers. Starting at level 3ish became the norm.

I currently play Fantasy AGE. I would say it fits your description of a fast-paced game that is more rules-lite than 5e.
 

Retreater

Legend
I don't remember ever having hirelings back in the day. On rare sessions we would have "large" groups of 6-8 players, but most of the time the party was 4-5 players.
I seem to remember a few things now that likely contributed to victory. (Things I would consider "bad practices" now.)
Leveling was much quicker, with characters gaining XP for casting spells, performing thieves tasks, etc. I would keep track of HP and AC and roll behind the screen, fudging rolls to keep the characters alive. We used imbalanced kits, optional rules (including psionics), and things we didn't understand (parrying, which we played as denying the attacks of a monster so big challenges can be stopped in their tracks until the party was ready for them). We also used the environment to do crazy things that defied physics.
 

Retreater

Legend
As for @Retreater asking for rules light, fun, and fast paced, come to the dark side, we have cookies. Depending on what you are looking for Blades in the Dark, Apocalypse World, or Fate could be what you are after.
I've run Dungeon World for the group. They seemed to enjoy it, but I had a very hard time GMing it due to its narrative components.
 

TwoSix

Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer
If you want to lower the lethality, you can just make hitting 0 HP much less dangerous. Maybe hitting 0 makes you wounded, so you can't cast spells or make attacks. (Or maybe spells take longer to cast, so you can heal yourself but have to wait till combat is over.)

If you take any damage while wounded, you become dying. If someone doesn't stabilize you in 3 rounds after you reach dying, or you take any more damage, you die.
 

I've run Dungeon World for the group. They seemed to enjoy it, but I had a very hard time GMing it due to its narrative components.
Dungeon World is ... not a very good implementation of the Apocalypse World engine and honestly it gives me a headache to run. I'm fine with running D&D and fine with running Apocalypse World, but Dungeon World to me feels as if they took the engine and gearing of a sports bike and dropped it into the chassis of a family car. I mean it has the horsepower to do the job, but the gearing in places is utterly weird.
 

Another thing about old-school play is that, once you got to a certain level, Raise Dead, Resurrection, even Reincarnation, were easily available. Even when you died, provided your fellow adventurers schlepped your remains back to civilization, you could still get better.
 

Snarf Zagyg

Notorious Liquefactionist
Funny how dangerous a roper feels when it can see you but you can't see it.

P8Um.gif
 


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