non-supernatural rogue/swashbuckler?

[Particle_Man]

I was thinking of a human rogue 4/swashbuckler 16, going for the swashbuckler athletic skills (adding in spot/listen/hide/move silently for the rogue.

feats are pretty standard: combat reflexes, two weapon fighting, weapons finesse, daring outlaw (lets you stack sneak attack damage with swashbuckler levels), imp. twf, greater twf, robilar's gambit and deft opportunist.

I thought about Bo9S stuff but I want to stay away from the overtly supernatural for this character.

So is this a viable build or am I missing something obvious?

 

[Dandu]

Why not Rogue1/Swarshbuckler3/Rogue16?

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Well, you're pretty much always better off trading Grace for Arcane Stunts from C.Mage, to get a bunch of swift action spell-like abilities instead of a weak reflex save bonus you won't need. If you stuck to the spells like Jump, maybe it could work without being overtly magical? SLAs have no components at all and as swift action casts don't provoke an AoO, so concentration should seldom be an issue. So you could just flavor them as something different.

The other obvious things you're missing:

The Craven feat (Champions of Ruin) to get +HD sneak attack damage, always worth the -2 fear saves if the feat's an option.

The Staggering Strike feat (C.adventurer) to make melee combat survivable.

The Dungeonscape level 3 variant (name escapes me) to trade your worthless Trap Sense for the ability to deal 1/2 SA damage to things immune to SA damage.

 

[Starbuck_II]

I was thinking of a human rogue 4/swashbuckler 16, going for the swashbuckler athletic skills (adding in spot/listen/hide/move silently for the rogue.

feats are pretty standard: combat reflexes, two weapon fighting, weapons finesse, daring outlaw (lets you stack sneak attack damage with swashbuckler levels), imp. twf, greater twf, robilar's gambit and deft opportunist.

I thought about Bo9S stuff but I want to stay away from the overtly supernatural for this character.

So is this a viable build or am I missing something obvious?

So no supernatural?
Easy.
Trade a few Swashbuckler levels for Swordsage (near the end):
Take Shadiow Blade feat.
Non-supernatural that you might use:
[SBLOCK]
Desert Wind
Flashing sun gives an extra attack.
Zephyr Counter
Desert Tempest

Diamond Mind:
Emerald razor
Sapphire nightmareblade
insightful strike
Bounding assua;t
Ruby Nightmare Blade
Rapid Counter
G. insightful strike
Avalanche of blades
Diamond nightmare blades

Set Sun:
Counter Charge
baffling defense
clever positioning
fiened opening
strike of the broken shield
stalking shadow
mirroed pursuit
scorpian parry
hydra slaying strike
fool's strike

Tiger:
Sudden Leap
Claw at the moon
Soaring raptor
Fountain of blood
Pouncing Charge
Swooping Dragon Strike
Feral Death Blow

Stone:
Charging Minotuar
mountaiun hammer
stone vise
Stone Dragon's fury
Bonecrusher
Overwhealming Mountain strike
Elder Mountain
Crushing vise
Irresistible Mountain
Ancient Mountain Hammer
Colossus Strike
[/SBLOCK]

 

[Particle_Man]

Why not Rogue1/Swarshbuckler3/Rogue16?

Because the Swashbuckler 16/Rogue 4 has BAB 19, which is higher (better still, he gets an additional +2 to hit when flanking once he gets high enough level). He also has more hp so is more survivable in meelee.

 

[Dandu]

I'd trade the extra HP and BAB for more skills, personally. You get more abilities out of Rogue than you do with Swashbuckler, such as Crippling Strike, Skill Mastery, a much better skill list (including the ever-popular UMD), Sneak Attack, and access to feats such as Craven and Staggering Strike.

 

[Particle_Man]

I'd trade the extra HP and BAB for more skills, personally. You get more abilities out of Rogue than you do with Swashbuckler, such as Crippling Strike, Skill Mastery, a much better skill list (including the ever-popular UMD), Sneak Attack, and access to feats such as Craven and Staggering Strike.

I don't need the extra skills for my character concept, I also don't want UMD (I'm deliberately trying to avoid magic stuff here - if that doesn't make sense to you, pretend that the setting is an anti-magic setting), and I already have sneak attack and access to feats such as Craven and Staggering Strike by virtue of the feat that lets me stack swashbuckler levels with rogue levels for the purpose of determining sneak attack dice. And he will get skill mastery with Jump and Tumble, by virtue of the Swashbuckler levels. Crippling Strike is ok, but I'll live without it.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Other options?

Throw Anything feat, for when you simply can't get close enough to carve your foe into various cutlets.

Shou Disciple PrCl for flurrying with any weapon, in armor. No Monk prereqs.

Exotic Weapon Master PrCl for stunts with exotic weapons.

Kensai PrCl for inherent magical boosts to your weapon of choice that need not actually appear to be magical (and other stuff besides).

 

[BENINHB]

Other options?

Throw Anything feat, for when you simply can't get close enough to carve your foe into various cutlets.

Shou Disciple PrCl for flurrying with any weapon, in armor. No Monk prereqs.

Exotic Weapon Master PrCl for stunts with exotic weapons.

Kensai PrCl for inherent magical boosts to your weapon of choice that need not actually appear to be magical (and other stuff besides).

I don't think i would PrC out of a build using Daring Outlaw unless it was a real quick dip for something very specific

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

He asked for options; those are options.

For all we know, one of those PrCls may include something he wanted to incorporate and didn't think of.