OFFICAL ERRATA: Hit points *DO NOT* change in polymorph

[Will]

The fact that alter self _does_ mention HP is a strong indication that it is a distinct rule. Otherwise, why bother?

As for uses of Polymorph: A varied tool for a number of situations you can't plan for, or don't have the breadth to prepare for (sorcerers).

consider: You're falling! Turn into a bird.
You're suddenly underwater! Turn into a ... well, lots of choices. (Party druid obliterated my careful underwater lair filled with nightwalkers. Turned into a giant squid and, combined with some spells, turned them into mulch in about two rounds)
It's dark! Turn into (something with darkvision/low light)
Oh no! Bandits are ahead! Turn into a bird. Hey, you're just a bird in a tree...

Polymorph functions as perfect disguise, barring the weirdos who walk around with true seeing at random times.

One thing it rocks for is to buff monks. They aren't wearing armor anyway, so turn them into some form of giant, and the vast majority of their gear adjusts.

Druids obviously get the benefit of long duration, so have more options.

Hmm. With a nod back to the old use of polymorph... polymorph any object can be used to permanently change people into, oh, hill giants and so forth. All for a measily 1360 gp.

I wish they had put a note to the effect that any permanent change involving a LA requires the character to, well, account for the adjustment.

But it would make a suitable backstory. 'I know I look like an awakened dire bear, but I'm actually a halfling.'

 

[rangerjohn]

The fact that alter self _does_ mention HP is a strong indication that it is a distinct rule. Otherwise, why bother?

As for uses of Polymorph: A varied tool for a number of situations you can't plan for, or don't have the breadth to prepare for (sorcerers).

consider: You're falling! Turn into a bird.
Or cast feather fall.
You're suddenly underwater! Turn into a ... well, lots of choices. (Party druid obliterated my careful underwater lair filled with nightwalkers. Turned into a giant squid and, combined with some spells, turned them into mulch in about two rounds)
Only if your able to cast it without a verbal component. Then you better be close to shore or it will expire before you reach land.
It's dark! Turn into (something with darkvision/low light)

By the RAW this doesn't work.
Oh no! Bandits are ahead! Turn into a bird. Hey, you're just a bird in a tree...

Polymorph functions as perfect disguise, barring the weirdos who walk around with true seeing at random times.

For twenty minutes max, unless extended and then its forty.

One thing it rocks for is to buff monks. They aren't wearing armor anyway, so turn them into some form of giant, and the vast majority of their gear adjusts.

They loose dex plus one, but other than that.

Druids obviously get the benefit of long duration, so have more options.

Hmm. With a nod back to the old use of polymorph... polymorph any object can be used to permanently change people into, oh, hill giants and so forth. All for a measily 1360 gp.

I wish they had put a note to the effect that any permanent change involving a LA requires the character to, well, account for the adjustment.

But it would make a suitable backstory. 'I know I look like an awakened dire bear, but I'm actually a halfling.'

Ansewers incorporated into post.

 

[Hypersmurf]

rangerjohn - it's always a good idea to do something to distinguish your new text from the quoted text.

Bolding is one possibility, as shown above.

Otherwise it can get annoying trying to figure out who said what, necessitating scrolling up and down between the original message and the new one...

-Hyp.
(Moderator)

 

[reiella]

rangerjohn - it's always a good idea to do something to distinguish your new text from the quoted text.

Bolding is one possibility, as shown above.

Otherwise it can get annoying trying to figure out who said what, necessitating scrolling up and down between the original message and the new one...

-Hyp.
(Moderator)

Sidenote, Italics are not a good idea (I thought it was italiziced to desiginate at first), since those are difficult to distinquish .

 

[Plane Sailing]

An interesting way of bypassing interpretive problems with CON, hp, ability drain etc might be the following houserule:

Polymorph grants you the Str and Dex of the form which you polymorph into. All your other attributes remain the same.

This would be a way of preventing hit points to change without making an end-run around the general rules that CON changes affect hit points (as one interpretation of the current rules does at the moment). Of course, this would be seen as a worst of all possible worlds by some, since it means that you don't get the Fort ST bonus or a few other probably insignificant effects. Still, it would make sense to me if it either changed CON (and had all the associated effects) or didn't change CON (and didn't).

The static hit points issue was there back in 1e too, although it was particularly considered wrt polymorph other - IIRC there was some kind of silly example about a brontosaurus polymorphed into an ant would be impossible to crush underfoot because of its huge number of hit points. It was excusable back then because creatures didn't have attributes and there wasn't a clear systematisation to everything.

It seems clear that at the moment each DM will have to discuss/negotiate with his players how this spell will function in their own campaign because WotC still havn't managed to be *crystal clear* about how the stupid thing is supposed to work.

Cheers

 

[Plane Sailing]

So it looks like the best use for the spell is the wizard making a wand for a ranger. Higher bab and hps.

And what point would this be exactly? Since the Ranger doesn't have polymorph on his spell list any more?

 

[Will]

Rangerjohn:

Er, missing the point with 'or cast featherfall.' I'm pointing out _flexibility_. Yes, it'd be nice to have featherfall... but what if you didn't cast it? Having polymorph means you can use Fly/Featherfall/Disguise/Burrowing/whatever without knowing you are going to need it ahead of time.

As for underwater and verbal... true, but if you are a sorcerer you might want Still so you can do that on the fly.

True about special qualities (darkvision, et al). This is one of the parts that really annoys me, frankly. I'd much rather have a player use Scent and other extraordinary abilities rather than moving ability scores around.

Just not things like fast healing. Of course, personally, I disagree with placing fast healing and regeneration as Extraordinary abilities. Me, I think they are supernatural...

Another use of the spell I just thought of... an effective enlarge/reduce. Halfling - Giant. Woo.

And as for time limits... so? Yes, it's not a long term illusion. But it's a highly versatile spell. What more do you want out of a 4th level spell?

 

[Iku Rex]

7.) Gain traits of the form such as low-light vision (animals) or immunity to poison (plants) [Note - this issue is still not 100% clear, but the designer, Andy Collins, is on the record as saying that you gain extraordinary type traits of the form via polymorph].

IIRC what he answered was something like "sure - whatever - I don't care" (paraphrasing ).

Since both the abilities you mentioned are extraordinary special qualities, you do not get them with polymorph.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Just not things like fast healing. Of course, personally, I disagree with placing fast healing and regeneration as Extraordinary abilities. Me, I think they are supernatural...

Couldn't agree more. I think the designers were on a major counter-intuitive kick when they assigned regeneration to "extraordinary". To my mind the Ex label should have been restricted to things which could be concievable in real life.

 

[glass]

I just listed the first two examples that came to mind. There are others I am sure.

Familiar hp are independent of the familiar's Con.


glass.