Oryx and Crake [Contains Spoilers!]

[devilish]

Hi All,

Just finished Oryx and Crake and I love the story.

Unfortunately, when it comes to fiction, I'm more akin to
the unthinking masses (or maybe because I'm American )
in that I get frustrated if certain things aren't spelled out for me.
I enjoy the story, don't get me wrong, but my mind spins on
an infinite loop trying to "answer" the unanswered questions
and I obsess for days.

For instance, the

Spoiler

end whisper

scene in
Lost in Translation drove me nuts!!

Spoiler

What did he say
to her

!?!?!?!?

So, all opinions/speculations are welcome:

Spoiler

Why, do you think, Crake
created the virus that destroyed civilization? Snowman alludes to it
at one point probably being about jealousy, but later states he
read the signs on Crake's refrigerator magnets, which happened before
he met Oryx.

What are your thoughts? How did you like the book? How possible
do you think it is?

Many thanks,
-D

 

[Olive]

Not her best work, but still an excellent book.

And

Spoiler

of course he made the virus...

no doubt in my mind.

 

[Pielorinho]

Moderator's Notes:

I'm going to take the liberty of changing the thread's title to include [spoilers!] in it. If anyone hasn't read the book, be aware that my post, and the posts that may follow, may contain unboxed spoilers: I doubt very much that a discussion of this book will be interesting to anyone who hasn't read it. If anyone objects to this, lemme know; I'm doing it as a convenience more than anything, and will be glad to change it back if folks want.[/moderator's notes]

And that's all the warning you're gonna get about spoilers. (Note that's not a moderator's warning ).

That said, I think the question was why Crake created the virus. And I think the answer was that he felt a deep, overwhelming despair at the state of humanity. Remember, he lived in a world in which kids watched children being raped on television for fun, in which executions and tortures were entertainments, in which social classes were divided to a ridiculous degree. He was in love with a woman who was repeatedly raped as a child; his best friend, by virtue of not being quite as smart, is going to a terrible school and will end up in an awful job. Everything is under human control, yet everything is out of control.

Crake kills humans off like a surgeon cutting out a tumor. He thinks that by removing the metastizing flesh, the healthy flesh can grow healthy again.

Of course, he's also playing God: for him, healthy flesh is that which he's designed. As badly as human control has made the world, he's still convinced that his control will be wonderful, that he's smart enough to engineer Paradise, to construct an Adam and an Eve that won't ever find the Tree of Knowledge. Therein lies the book's tragic irony.

That's my take, anyway. I liked the book pretty well.

Daniel

 

[Olive]

I'm starting to think that you and I have distrubingly similar taste in fiction Daniel.

And that's a much more detailed explanation of it, that rings true to me.

It's interesting, most people I spoke to found it too dark in tone. I certainly found it dark, but that was what I enjoyed about it.

Anyway, in reponse to the 'is it possible' question, I'd say yes, but I don't know enough about it to really know. I don't have the full time RAs that Attwood is lucky enough to have, and I don't really have a scientific bent, but there you go. It rang true to me.

 

[devilish]

Thanks for the "moderation" - wasn't sure if I should put the spoiler title.

Here's just some random mental dribblings:

I guess I didn't see it as part of his "plan" unless he was the mad genius who
could interact with people knowing he had "this mission" in mind (not to mix
metaphors/genres, but almost like a Magneto.) Why bring in Jimmy for PR? To be his confessor?

Also, was there any significance to Oryx leaving that night -- did she know
something, do you think, or that was just the day it happened?
Did Crake kill her before coming to the dome or just use her to get at
Jimmy's emotions to assist in his "suicide." Why would Crake kill himself
if he was on the "mission?"

It also almost seems an oversight to have such perfect humans --- but if
they encountered old humans, they'd be in trouble - as implied in the ending.
The Crakers wouldn't know how/why to defend themselves against survivors,
which there apparently are. I can't see if Crake had this end-goal in mind,
that he'd let such a huge flaw through.

That's why I get the subtle feeling that either a) it was an impulse move; anger driven or jealousy to wipe out humanity or b) a real accident.
Crake planned on a random sterilizer, maybe it mutated into a killer-virus.
The only hint we get that Crake intended mass-murder was in Jimmys
"to-whom-it-may-concern" note where he says that Crake left on the computer to let Jimmy know the truth -- maybe Jimmy made that up to
give himself closure as to how this could've happened? Maybe that's
why the suicide -- a shame that his perfect plan went AWOL.

One criticism : I'm not overly keen on stories where the one brilliant
genius can be the hero/villain without any checks on him/her. Everything
up until that point seemed possible, until reading that he was 'above the
law.' I had the same feel for Ender's Game -- loved the story but
found the child-prodigy-cum-God a bitter pill to swallow.


Thanks for the input, Olive and Daniel. Curious - what other fiction
are you both reading that's similar?

-D

PS:
Just heard about a shortage of flu vaccines and footnoted to the article
was that we may have a pandemic this year of flu. Shook a scary vibe
with me after reading this.

 

[Pielorinho]

Just heard about a shortage of flu vaccines and footnoted to the article
was that we may have a pandemic this year of flu. Shook a scary vibe
with me after reading this.

Heh.

heh.

heh?

Interesting ideas--it never even occurred to me that Jimmy may have made up Crake's confession. I'm not sure I believe it, however: his creation of the Perfect Humans wouldn't really have meant anything if they'd been introduced into the rotten old world. I really got the impression that he'd been planning this for years. Remember how Jimmy's mom died, how other scientists and dogs (I think) died? Didn't they dissolve into pink froth as the result of some experiment, and wasn't Crake implicated? It's been several months since I read the book, so I'm a little fuzzy on the details.

Yeah, Olive, I've noticed we've got pretty similar tastes . If you were local, I'd invite you to our book club: it's small (my wife, a long-term friend, and my brother's girlfriend), and we need more folks in it.

Other books that remind me of Oryx and Crake:
Kalki, by Gore Vidal. I actually didn't like it very much, but it's got a lot of the same ideas in it.
Cat's Cradle and Galapagos, both by Kurt Vonnegut. Two more end-of-the-world books, albeit much funnier.
Parable of the Sower, by Octavia Butler. I could easily imagine this book happening in the same world as Oryx and Crake.
Neuromancer, by William S. Gibson. I heard him speak once, and he confessed irritation about people who called his books dystopian. "People," he said, "they're not dystopian--for like 90% of the world's population, it's already that bad! This is how people are living today!" A bit exaggerated, but a chilling idea nonetheless.

And, of course, if you like a little politics mixed into your fiction (NOT THAT WE'RE GOING TO DISCUSS THE MERITS OF SAID POLITICS HERE!), there's some great authors out there:
George Orwell and HG Wells, two of the grandaddies of the genre, very explicitly made this combination. In fact, Oryx and Crake owes a debt to The Time Machine, now that I think about it.
I can't say enough good about China Mieville.

Daniel