(OT) Any vegans out there?

[tleilaxu]

When I was in college i lived in a Co-op which had vegetarians living there. Therefore, for dinner, whoever was cooking had to provide a vegetarian option. I was lazy and so only cooked vegetarian. I learned how to make a lot of good vegetarian dishes. I didn't really miss meat that much.

However, during my Junior year a Vegan wanted to move in. This met general disapproval as it would cause to much trouble in the shared preperation of meals.

 

[Kahuna Burger]

firstly think about a little use of spellcheck. nothing like having words spelled correctly to make even stupid ideas sound not so much so.

*laugh* a wonderful setting of the tone... Thanks for alerting me to the usefulness of your comments right off the bat.

there are no vegetarian cat foods available because the basic nutritional needs for felines is that of high high amounts of protein and fat.

yes dear, I explained this in my first post on the issue.

cats do not have any molars for crushing of nuts, berries, etc. their digestional tracts are very long for their size. this is for taking in animal proteins and processing them correctly. yes, even your kibble.

Actually, the animal protiens in kibble are already pretty processed. Thats why the litter box of a cat fed a high quality kibble smells much less than that of one fed a more raw diet... Though long, the digestive tract of a cat is still ineffecient. (hence why dogs like cat food even after the trip. )

i think HUMANS are allowed to treat their own bodies in any which way that they see fit.

but it is simply irresponsible to try to change the evolutionary design of your pets. why do people feel the need to try to put their morality and sensibilites on their pets?

Because we are the people and they are the pet... specieist, I know, but thats life. Thats why we change the evolutionary design of our pets reproduction and social structure. Why we force socialize dogs to live happily with cats and cats to be nice to the guine pig. Why we take something as biologically basic as the emilination of waste and fit it into our socially accepted structure.

And why some people may want to extend their boycott of the meat industry to the leftovers found in pet food. All of the above can be done badly and hurt the animal. The last is hardest to do right, which is why I recomend against it constantly to curious customers*. But I have seen it done well and mention that out of honesty.

mailing away for some silly protein mixture to try to make your cat as politically and socially aware as you are is simply absurd.

As absurd as surgically altering your cat to impose your political and social views on overeproduction on it? As absurd as making a "bathroom" for it and getting upset if it breaks your social mores? You are not making an argument consistant with the rest of pet ownership.

*oh yeah, I've worked in veterinary and animal care environments for the better part of the last 7 years. Please don't try to educate me on animals - its good for the amusement value but not much else.

Kahuna burger

 

[Pielorinho]

eXodus, congrats on your cooking experience. For my part, I've tasted the dish in question; and given that I've previously tried a few of your suggestions when making the dish and found them to harm rather than improve it, I ain't impressed by theory. Actually, I find it a little presumptuous of you to critique a recipe untasted. No matter how good an author I was, I wouldn't critique a book unread.

FWIW, the problem with turning a cat vegan isn't its high need for protein: it's that cats are unable to manufacture a specific amino acid, taurine, which is only found in animal sources. That's probably the supplement that Kahuna Burger's friends send off for.

Daniel

 

[Mark Chance]

firstly think about a little use of spellcheck. nothing like having words spelled correctly to make even stupid ideas sound not so much so.

Spelling advice from someone who cannot use the "shift" key doesn't carry much weight.

Originally posted by Kahuna Burger
oh yeah, I've worked in veterinary and animal care environments for the better part of the last 7 years. Please don't try to educate me on animals - its good for the amusement value but not much else.

So in just those almost-seven years of working in said environments, you've learned everything there is to know about animals? Wow. Impressive.

 

[Kahuna Burger]

eXodus
FWIW, the problem with turning a cat vegan isn't its high need for protein: it's that cats are unable to manufacture a specific amino acid, taurine, which is only found in animal sources. That's probably the supplement that Kahuna Burger's friends send off for.

Taurine it is... The effects of taurine deficincy are pretty obvious, its not something that you don't notice till your cat keels over. I honestly didn't believe that healthy vegitarian cats were possible until I met my friends' critters in person. Now I know its possible but REALLY hard and expensive.

Other people have commented on cat's hunting... Aside from tapeworm worries, this actually provides another way for some semivegitarians to avoid buying animal based pet foods (since we've already gone over in this thread that some humans ethically distinguish between factory farmed beef and the venison you shot yourself...) Feed your cat as nutritionally complete a diet as you can and leave cheese out in the kitchen....

Kahuna Burger

 

[Kahuna Burger]

So in just those almost-seven years of working in said environments, you've learned everything there is to know about animals? Wow. Impressive.

*laugh* you're a funny guy. At least I assume that was a joke rather than you actually thinking that my disinterest in revising years of practical and 'book learned' pet care knowlege because some guy on the internet insults me means I think I know everything... You're way too smart and funny a guy to fling a weak strawman like that, aren't you?

Kahuna burger

 

[Mark Chance]

*laugh* you're a funny guy. everyone loves you.

A group of Franciscan monks have been forced to close their florist shop. Seems the shop was too close to Hugh Hefner's Playboy Mansion, and the presence of the robed religionists was disconcerting to Mansion staff, residents, and visitors. So, Hefner took the monks to court to force them to move, and he won.

Which just proves: Only Hugh can prevent florist friars!

Thank you, thank you! I'm here all week! Don't forget to tip your waitresses!

 

[eXodus]

my wife has taken care of dogs and cats in a kennel environment as a career. also her knowledge and mine of dogs, genetics, evolution and pet social structure is pretty extensive.

firstly, if you want to put it into complete evolutionary ideas, pet dogs and cats are not natural creatures. none of my three dogs, a staffordshire bull terrier, boston terrier or american staffordshire terrier are natural beasts. they were bred and designed by humans over thousands of years.

cats a little bit less. some breeds of cats are still very close to their wild counterparts. even the most pampered and fluffy cat is a predator. everyone knows someone who had a cat who would stalk and attack other animals or even their 'owner.' that is not a sign of complete domestication.

to feed a cat or a dog a vegetarian diet is something i cannot condone, understand or recognize as even being an intelligent idea.

morality issues? well, cats and dogs have NO morals. none. they are animals.

health issues? well, cats and dogs are designed to eat animal proteins. domesticated dogs can intake a good amount of plant fibers for additional nutrition but it does not replace the need for animal proteins.

political issues? well, i have not sat and talked to emma, addie and pixie (my dogs) about their political stance on eating animal proteins. but i am thinking that they do not have a whole lot to say on the subject.

people who do feed their pets in this manner are doing it for their own reasons. they are doing it so they can feel like they are making some sort of difference. they are trying to impose their ideals on ANIMALS.

what these people really should do is continue livign their lives how they see fit, but have enough universal awareness to not try to make little fuzzy humans out of their animals. hell, these people should not even have pets.

yes, cats leave a whole lot of undigested protein in their feces. so do tigers who hunt down their prey. should the zoos start their lions, tiger and cougars on a vegetarian diet for efficiency?

 

[Dinkeldog]

Okay, I think the animal vegetarian issue is done now. Can we stick to people and what is yummy for us?

Thanks.

 

[eXodus]

eXodus, congrats on your cooking experience. For my part, I've tasted the dish in question; and given that I've previously tried a few of your suggestions when making the dish and found them to harm rather than improve it, I ain't impressed by theory. Actually, I find it a little presumptuous of you to critique a recipe untasted. No matter how good an author I was, I wouldn't critique a book unread.

Daniel

i did not mean to offend you. but as a chef it is commonplace to read a recipe and have a really good idea of what i will be like without actually making it. i am very rarely surprised by foods. it just comes with experience. list ingredients, cooking methods, i am going to know how it tastes by reading it. and more often then not without ever making it i can tweak a recipe into something better.

all in all it is a good dish. (even without making it) it hits on all of the major taste desires; salt, sweet, spicy, cool. the use of the rice is nice. most would go with simple white rice.

i critiqued it based on my own experiences. i eat tofu everyday with at least one meal, and i love to press it. it is so much better that way. it takes in marinades better, has a nicer texture, and allows it to be dry enough on its exterior to get good texture from a saute pan or oven.

coming soon!

one of eXodus' favorite tofu dishes!