D&D 5E (2014) playtest 18th level PC vs town...lFqW reborn... or not

[travathian]

Don't put words in my mouth. It is distasteful and only further proves how weak and pathetic your argument is.


But here goes. I just got done running the above adventure with my group.
0 townsfolk deaths
1 mind flayer dead
0 PC deaths

Lessons learned: smart players know how to play

Yah, now I have evidence to the contrary!

 

[SilverfireSage]

Don't put words in my mouth. It is distasteful and only further proves how weak and pathetic your argument is.


But here goes. I just got done running the above adventure with my group.
0 townsfolk deaths
1 mind flayer dead
0 PC deaths

Lessons learned: smart players know how to play

Yah, now I have evidence to the contrary!

Yes because 7 words and three numbers is the same as what GM posted. Besides, you posted that, what, four minutes after my post? I sincerely doubt you had time to run this.

Why are you even bothering to come on here and take a dump on someone's post? Don't you have something better to do? I would understand if you were nice and had some constructive criticism, but all your posts have boiled down to is "that's stupid, that's not how it would happen." Relax, go take a breather, and if you have something constructive to say, then say it nicely.

 

[sidonunspa]

Trolls..... someone apparently feed one...

 

[Umbran]

Polish a turd all you want, it is still a turd.

Hey, dude, you're free to disagree, and have an opinion, but please watch how you state it. We expect posters to treat each other with a certain minimum of respect. It is part of Rule #1 of EN World, which is "Keep it civil." You are on the edge here - please walk it back and be a little more polite going forward. Thanks.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

You didn't have a bard, you had a triple classed character with some bard levels whose healing was nothing compared to an 18th level cleric.

ok, maybe you missed the concepts... part of this test (proposed in the thread about 6.7.8.9. level spells) is to see how the character shape up, one is a full caster, one is about half a caster, the third is a noncaster...

In a one off game with nothing but combat? Why not? Or play the cleric yourself, and just the other players make plot/progression decisions.

again, the players didn't know any of what was being tested, just that they had pregen high level characters and where testing something...

I can't help but think you are jerking my chain at this point... the basic assumption for a party of 18th level characters is that they have no magic items?!? Yet a small farming town has a bunch? Where did you get this from? By the end of Lost Mines of Phandelver the party has magic items equivalent to your 18th level party . . ?

if the game works with 0 items or not is a selling point, and I just picked a few cool items for each party member... but since it matters to you, I have run many 2e, 3e, and 4e games with about this level of items into the teens, I have also run game where by the second adventure PCs had more then in this scenero... the items I gave the people in town was treasure...

Your point? It is a small pissant town, I expect them to have virtually no magical items.

look, no one had a ton, a few more experienced town members had little things the PCs could pick up...

Again, no competent 18th level wizard is going to fail to have fly available, either as a prepared spell or scroll or magic item. It is simply so versatile and useful. You can argue that not all mages need the same spells all you want, but show me an 18th level mage without the ability to fly and I question just how they survived to get to that level. Or how poor the DM is.

You know, I've seen tons of games go with no flyers at all. About half of the campaigns in my history had either no one that could fly at all, and of those most of the time it was the whole party had a way to do it...

Arcane gate? Why would an evoker have that prepared, and then not use it for the party to escape?

by the time the wizard thought that there was a reason to 'escape' things had gone pear shaped... by the way I never promised my best powergamers, but these are players...

Delayed blast fireball is terrible. Finger of death? Why not the infinitely useful teleport (another must have spell) or prismatic spray?

oh great... must have spells, I hate 'must have' anything

And wands and scrolls and such don't make a mage or cleric more powerful any more so than plate mail +5 and a holy avenger makes a paladin more powerful.

+3 is the highest in this edition, and the wizard was far and away the most powerful and most useful character, yet you insist it was gimped?

Are you seriously claiming that because the DMG isn't out yet that there is some default that characters don't have or will get magic items? Have you ever played D&D before? lol

all of the time... I have been playing 20ish years. again there is nothing wrong with this test... except you didn't like the result

*yawn* Seriously? You are claiming you can show your work? Well , I can show that a single skeleton can kill an army of 18th level characters. Lets see, army of 100 18th level warriors, walking across a rope bridge a mile long over a chasm a mile deep. Skeleton cuts rope. They all fall to their deaths. Yah! TPK, I showed my work. One skeleton = army of 18th level characters. Woohoo!

*yawn* Seriously? You are claiming your theory work is more important then a real playtest with real players...

 

[GMforPowergamers]

But here goes. I just got done running the above adventure with my group.
0 townsfolk deaths
1 mind flayer dead
0 PC deaths

Lessons learned: smart players know how to play

Yah, now I have evidence to the contrary!

gee I wonder what was different... I had the controlled NPCs start by storming the room the PCs slept in... they had no ongoing spells or items on because they had been in a safe town and sleeping/resting as part of an extended rest...

 

[Authweight]

I think it's obvious that high level characters would have lots of resources to escape or evade this scenario. Even mid-level characters could probably get away without much trouble.

The question posed, however, wasn't "can high level characters escape a town trying to kill them?" The question posed, as I understand it, was "does a high level town pose a legitimate challenge to high level characters?" And this proves it really does. Even level 18 PCs can't just walk into a town and carve it up. Their best bet is still to evade combat and deal with the villagers by other means.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

The question posed, however, wasn't "can high level characters escape a town trying to kill them?" The question posed, as I understand it, was "does a high level town pose a legitimate challenge to high level characters?" And this proves it really does. Even level 18 PCs can't just walk into a town and carve it up. Their best bet is still to evade combat and deal with the villagers by other means.

yes, my big take away is that even at the highest levels in 5e it is not easy to walk into a large number of combat encounters...

one of the early design goals was for Orcs to be threats through out the whole life of the game... I bet a huge orc encampment would make even 20th level heroes pause... witch is good

 

[Giltonio_Santos]

Not that it matters at all, but I've also been running D&D for the last 20 years or so, and I must say that, in my experience, real PCs played to the "teen levels" have more resemblance with the ones described in the initial post than the Christmas trees full of "must have spells" that the other poster describes as the rule. YMMV, as always.

 

[Authweight]

Not that it matters at all, but I've also been running D&D for the last 20 years or so, and I must say that, in my experience, real PCs played to the "teen levels" have more resemblance with the ones described in the initial post than the Christmas trees full of "must have spells" that the other poster describes as the rule. YMMV, as always.

I think it just depends greatly on playstyle.