Protecting Troops from Fireball

[green slime]

Actually, I think most wizards would be able to hold off an army pretty effectively. Most combat units become ineffective once they've taken 50% casualties; morale and cohesion start slipping much earlier than that. For example, the US marines taking Peliliu in the Pacific theatre of WW2 were hardened veterans and one of the most elite infantry units ever fielded, and even they lost combat effectiveness after facing (invisible) artillery and mortars which inflicted 50% casualties -- and they had the benefit of their own fire support and knowledge of modern weapons.

Then again, the German paratroopers during the invasion of Crete suffered up towards 90% casualties, and continued to fight.... Of course they were never used operationaly again as paratroopers for the rest of that war.

But that is truly exceptional.

 

[lukelightning]

There is no way I'd allow the "summon something to intercept the fireball" tactic. The ability to block anything like this is the sort of thing "dedicated bodyguard" type PrC's get. There is no way a creature can ready to fling itself in front of a fireball or other missile.

 

[pogre]

Although this idea will not fit your criteria, it is a way to maintain the pseudo-medieval flavor. IMC armies typically have ancient standards (think Roman Legion Eagles) that give the unit bearing them a SR. These are much like magical standards from WFB. Once the standard has fallen, a unit is toast.

 

[Errant]

Let's face facts here: Warrior1s vs. fireballs are like doughboys charging artillery. They gonna die.

Thats pretty much the way I see it too.

I can easily see battlefield command groups including adepts armed with wands of Dispel Magic for counterspelling, but even allowing for Andargor's spell selections you're unlikely to have enough caster of high enough level to protect an entire army. Your fireball throwing wizards is really just highly mobile artillery and artillery has always been murder on close formations.

If you're holding to traditional population spreads, wizards will chew up a lot of troops but when you're fielding tens or hundreds of thousands of troops in a big battle (not unusual by real world historical battles I think) a few hundred taken out by fireballs probably won't be the deciding factor.

Plus, if I was commanding an army of thousands, my PC-type elite forces would not be in the main formations, they'd be the ones moving throw the lines targeting the enemy PC-type elites, with the fireball throwing types very high on the hit list.

 

[Aust Diamondew]

Spell casters can be handled just with archers who ready actions to try and disrupt spell casting or with your own spell casters or heroes (ie the PCs).

And generally in my games spell casters only do really major damage during the initial stages of the battle after that unless they are high level they have probably run out of fireballs and what not and are just using wands of magic missle which aren't too great.

 

[Shadowbane2]

Have the first rank have Tower Shields and use them for Full Cover.

Second rank should have polearms of some kind.

Voila.

Cheap and practical, except EVERY rank should have plearms. Swiss armies employed similar tactics in the 15th century to eliminate Charles the Bold's Burgundian menage. NEVER FAILED. If a few units of pike arme3d heavily in the front and flanks can crush a professional army, it sholud be able to take on a spell caster.

(Provided you're fighting on a steppe or something of the sort. if that wizard gets high ground, I'd either go to the roman "turtle" formation, or simply get tome low level wizards in the unit to help dispel the fireballs.)

 

[melkorspawn]

How many spellcasters did Charles the Bold have?

 

[Shadowbane2]

How many spellcasters did Charles the Bold have?

The point I'm trying to make is simply that minimal cover can go a long way. In battle, it's intelligent to treat a high-level spellcaster as a unit of it's own, as a fireball spell is much like a powerfull hail of arrows and then some. Simply put, one rank granting full cover can protect a unit from anything short of an earthquake. Whether it's 1476 a.d. or 679 g.z. make little difference.

 

[Errant]

Maybe I'm missing something, but just how effective are Tower Shields supposed to be?

All a wizard has to do is ready an action to throw his fireball when the shieldbearers start to move, or simply aim over heir heads. Fireball is a spread so it will wrap around the shields. Or is there a suggestion that a formation of troops can maintain a perfectly intact shield wall while moving?

Thats assuming the first fireball doesn't just destroy the typical 5 hardness, 20 hp tower shields. If you want tougher shields the cost will be astronomical on an army scale.

 

[dcollins]

FAQ entry on cover from tower shields:

Spread effects reach around the shield if they normally would extend into your space...

Link to discussion thread: http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=158848