D&D 5E Quintis the Warlord, what can he do and when can he do it?

[Paul Smart]

IMO:

1: Help as a bonus action. ....

11: When you help, it last for an entire round.

Mellored could you expand on what you mean by this. This sounds very interesting.

 

[Paul Smart]

Based on what I wrote here:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/showth...to-make-it-happen/page8&p=7040757#post7040757

Class Features
As a warlord (or commander or marshal), you gain the following class features.

Hit Points
Hit Dice: 1d8 per warlord level
Hit Points at 1st Level: 8 + your Constitution modifier
Hit Points at Higher Levels: 1d8 (or 5) + your
Constitution modifier per warlord level after 1st

Proficiencies
Armor: Light armour, medium armour, shields
Weapons: Simple weapons, martial weapons
Tools: None

Saving Throws: Constitution, Intelligence
Skills: Choose two from Acrobatics Athletics, History, Insight, Intimidation, Medicine, and Persuasion

Equipment
You start with the following equipment, in addition to the
equipment granted by your background:
• (a) chain mail or (b) leather armour, longbow, and 20 arrows
• (a) a martial weapon and a shield or (b) two martial weapons
• (a) a light crossbow and 20 bolts or (b) two handaxes
• (a) a dungeoneer’s pack or (b) an explorer’s pack

Class Features
1: Grant Attack. Ally of your choice that can hear you makes a weapon attack as a reaction. Recharges after a short or long rest. Tactical Actions. If you are not surprised, you can allow an ally to reroll their initiative.
2: Assistive Action. Can use the Help action as a bonus action. You can also aid saving throws or defence. Field Medic. You stabilise allies as a bonus action on your turn. Additionally, you grant the creatures a bonus 1d8 Hit Dice. Creatures can only gain the bonus Hit Dice once per long rest.
3: Warlord subclass feature
4: Ability Score Improvement
5: Coordinated Attack. When you use Grant Attack, you can make a single weapon attack.
6: Warlord subclass feature
7: Improved Grant Attack. When an ally attacks, they can move before or after they attack, up to half their speed.
8: Ability Score Improvement
9: Rally. All friendly creatures of your choice within 60 feet who can hear you gain 1d10+warlord level temporary hit points. Once per short or long rest. Field Medic. Instead grant 2 bonus Hit Dice, which are d10s
10: Warlord subclass feature
11: Reactive Support When an ally you can see fails a saving throw, as a reaction you can allow them to reroll.
12: Ability Score Improvement
13: Rally. (two uses)
14: Improved Reactive Support When you grant an ally a rerolled saving throw, they add 1d6 to the new roll.
15: Warlord subclass feature
16: Ability Score Improvement
17: Grant Attack. (two uses) Field Medic. Bonus Hit Dice are d12s
18: Warlord subclass feature
19: Ability Score Improvement
20: Triage. When you stabilise a creature they regain hit points equal to your warlord level.

That's what I'd do if I needed to make a warlord and was limited by the design of 4e in terms of options and design...
Design of much of the powers based on all of 30 minutes of brainstorming, so the design is shaky at best.

Jester David, lots of great ideas in this post. This is very helpful.

 

[mellored]

Mellored could you expand on what you mean by this. This sounds very interesting.

You can take the help action as a bonus action, which gives someone advantage for 1 attack, or skill check. It's the same as the mastermind rogue.
At level 11, you can grant someone advantage on all of their attacks for the turn instead of just 1 attack. So it works with multi-attacks.

Another thought is helping more than one ally at once. So the whole party get's advantage on their stealth checks, or to attack the one guy.

 

[Jester David]

Subclasses
These are tricky. The subclasses in 4e are almost wholly mechanical. The stories of the subclasses are pretty light.

From a build perspective, there could be healer focused warlord, a buffer that improves ally damage, a debuffer that penalizes enemies, a movement focuses builld, and a most self sufficient build.
But there's not a lot of story there. No narrative hooks. Nothing to tell someone what the subclass does without having to read the mechanics.

Ideally, the subclasses would be actual terms. Not "inspiring warlord" or "skirmishing warlord".
Something like the vanguard, who leads from the front line. A cornet or standard-bearer that issues orders and has a flag or symbol that inspires morale. A battle crier that has inspiring shouts. The ambusher or guerrilla that is based on surprise attacks. A reconnoitre that evaluates enemies and assesses weaknesses. Interdictor that interrupts enemy movements and actions. Perfida, which lures enemies into traps through deception.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Tony I am trying to build this on a Warlock chasis to have maximum flexibility for sub classes.

Doesn't hurt that the Warlock is about as close as 4e comes to AEDU, I guess.

There are really a lot of potential sub-classes. There's the 4e 'builds,' of course: Inspiring, Tactical, Bravura, Resourceful, Skirmishing & Insightful. There was also an archery option, but with 5e's seamless handling of STR v DEX weapon use that's a non-issue. Then there was the CharOp LazyLord, and the more character-driven builds that could be done using it - in essence a non-combatant combatant, the kind of side-kick character that couldn't pull it's own weight, before, but was suddenly workable.

Inspiring is just what it says on the tin, the high-CHA 'leader' who helps everyone want to do better (and actually succeed at it, too). It works conceptually just as well as a less combatant character as the Tactical does (if not better), but mechanically 4e Tactical builds did the 'lazylord' better. It'd be nice if that didn't have to be the case, this time around.

Tactical was the INT-based build, less about inspiring word, more about setting allies up, so more buffing, granted actions and the like. In 5e, the link to granted actions needn't be so solid (as above), and the objective of Tactics and strategy and gambits and manuevering and whatnot - to get the enemy to make mistakes - could be emphasized more, something that shaded too far over into the Controller Role to be a go in 4e.

Resourceful. A much cooler concept than the INT/CHA split-the-difference mechanics it got, the Resourceful Warlord is the reactive opportunist, who makes the most of every situation. Again, could include things that were inapropriate to the Leader Role in 4e.

Skirmishing: all about movement, could probably be folded into Tactical unless it were maybe developed more in the lines of leveraging DEX options, light weapons/armor, stealth, mobility, good ranged attacks - not just for itself, but coordinating with allies using those tactics in one way or degree or another.

Insightful: Very poorly realized, IMHO, was meant to be a perceptive WIS-based build. The concept makes a lot of sense, understanding the enemy is all-important, right? This could be a more enemy-focused sub-class, less support, more de-buffing and strategems.

Bravura: Weirdest name, probably easiest to do in 5e since it was very fightery. This is the guy who gets a combat style and Extra attack, maybe some sort of personal damage mitigation. The Bladesinger to the Battlemaster's Eldritch Knight.

And of course, there's the 'Princess' build, the non-combatant, the sidekick, the backseat adventurer. It's a fixture in genre, and can be cool or downright annoying to the audience, and helps at best infrequently or indirectly, mostly it instigates and give the heroes motivation to be heroic. As a Warlord build, it'd be more mechanically pro-active, so it's contributing, and something for the player to do, but 'in the fiction,' it's the non-combatant (or plucky less capable combatant) the real heroes are sticking up for. In 4e, you could CharOp a very effective LazyLord that way - in 5e, with less emphasis on balance, who know what build will be the OP one(s)?

 

[mellored]

Along with help action stuff, the you could also grant the dodge and hide action. Perhaps allowing an ally to do the same thing.

Without a trace: when you take the hide action, each ally within 60' can use their reaction to take the hide action.

Possibly as part of the Guerilla subclass.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Extra Attack feels like a big deal - I suppose if it's OK for full-casters lik eWar Clerics and Valor Bards and even Bladesinger Wizards, it's probably fine for the Warlord - but I'd prefer to see it is an option with alternate features, or appearing in a sub-class, or at least absent from one or more sub-classes, to leave more design space open.

That's another general suggestion: Some classes, like the Fighter, are very much 'all there' in the basic chassis, with sub-classes not making a huge difference to it's primary function. IMHO, the Warlord would benefit from having a lighter chassis, with more-developed sub-classes. A bravura should almost certainly have extra attack (or a feature that can be used to get it), other sub-classes, maybe not.

Do like the revised ranger, and put extra Attack or equivalent in the subclass.

Bravura gets extra Attack, Tactical gets less limited Attack granting, etc.

i definitely think if we are endeavoring to build an enworld Warlord class, we should take a long look at Star Wars Saga Noble talents to steal as class features. Especially the leadership, influence(inspiration?), and the noble talent trees from Galaxy of Intrigue, Galaxy at War, and Clone Wars books.

The mechanical structure is more easily translated to 5e, and the class is basically a much more conceptually and mechanically broad warlord.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Do like the revised ranger, and put extra Attack or equivalent in the subclass.
Bravura gets extra Attack, Tactical gets less limited Attack granting, etc.

See, this is the danger of threads like this for me. I'm really starting to like the idea. Now, if the Warlord gets Extra Attack on the chassis, or if no sub-class gets Extra Attack, I'm going to be disappointed. :sigh: Nothing worse than good ideas for long-awaited core classes. ;P

i definitely think if we are endeavoring to build an enworld Warlord class, we should take a long look at Star Wars Saga Noble talents to steal as class features. Especially the leadership, influence(inspiration?), and the noble talent trees from Galaxy of Intrigue, Galaxy at War, and Clone Wars books.

The mechanical structure is more easily translated to 5e, and the class is basically a much more conceptually and mechanically broad warlord.

I'm not familiar. What're the high points?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

See, this is the danger of threads like this for me. I'm really starting to like the idea. Now, if the Warlord gets Extra Attack on the chassis, or if no sub-class gets Extra Attack, I'm going to be disappointed. :sigh: Nothing worse than good ideas for long-awaited core classes. ;P

I'm not familiar. What're the high points?

Yeah, same. After the revised ranger and Artificer, I kinda lost interest in tinkering with this stuff. Still off and on tinkering with a full class Assassin, because I have no hope they will do one, and with some alternate assassin subclasses for ranger and warlock.
But every time the warlord comes up, I can't help but get my tinker tools out.

Anyway, the noble from saga can do a lot of the same things the warlord does in combat, but also has a ton more out of combat options along similar lines. It's like a warlord/face/soft skill monkey. I don't have the books on me to list any specific mechanics right now, but I'll try to do so later.

 

[cbwjm]

Do like the revised ranger, and put extra Attack or equivalent in the subclass.

Bravura gets extra Attack, Tactical gets less limited Attack granting, etc.

i definitely think if we are endeavoring to build an enworld Warlord class, we should take a long look at Star Wars Saga Noble talents to steal as class features. Especially the leadership, influence(inspiration?), and the noble talent trees from Galaxy of Intrigue, Galaxy at War, and Clone Wars books.

The mechanical structure is more easily translated to 5e, and the class is basically a much more conceptually and mechanically broad warlord.

I've been meaning to have a look at the star wars saga noble talent trees, it wasn't something that I immediately jumped out at me until you mentioned it. Making extra attack in a similar vein to the revised ranger is a good idea.