Races With Wisdom Bonus And No LA - Possible?

[Nazhkandrias]

Alright, I've been penning up a society of Druidic creatures. They mostly keep to uncivilized marshes, not necessarily out of lack of intelligence, but from a conscious choice to embrace a simpler, more natural lifestyle. Naturally, favored classes will be wilderness-based (maybe Druid or Ranger), but I've had some inner conflicts concerning racials, especially ability adjustments. A penalty to Charisma seems appropriate, due to the reclusive, introspective nature of the race, and I was thinking a penalty to Dexterity due to physical build (I might be publishing this in the future, so I won't give details). I was wondering, would a Wisdom bonus be appropriate here, for an LA +0 creature? It's just that mental bonuses can really be an issue, since they give huge advantages to casters, and I can't think of any LA +0 races that have mental bonuses period (save for Gray Elves, but that's for Intelligence). To simplify it, this was what I had in mind...

Wilderness-Based Race

- +2 Wis, -2 Dex, -2 Cha
- Medium, 20 ft. land speed, maybe swim speed of 10-20 ft.?
- Low-light vision.
- Very small natural armor bonus (maybe +1 or +2).
- Decent Hold Breath ability.
- +4 to Swim (if no swim speed is added), +2 Survival, +1 to Knowledge (nature) (+2 if swim speed is used).
- Favored Class - Either Druid or Ranger, haven't made up my mind yet. Barbarian doesn't seem likely.

This is just a rough draft, but does it seem like it wouldn't cross into the LA +1 category? I tried to balance out the Wisdom bonus with a penalty to Dexterity and Charisma, to ensure that these guys won't make beastly (good is OK, but beastly is not) Druids or Rangers (that Dexterity hurts) or Clerics (since Charisma is pretty important, especially with Turn-related feats, and the Dexterity hurts anybody). As for the other stuff, I figured that the skill bonuses aren't too big of a deal, although they do complement Druid and Ranger nicely. Low-light is pretty standard, and the 20-ft. speed seems to balance out most of the other issues. So, is this currently overpowered (what could balance it)? Underpowered (what could I afford to add)?

 

[nittanytbone]

Why not use a LA+0 variant off of lizard folk?

Or even just use Lizard Folk. LA isn't nearly as bad for NPCs as it is for PCs.

For example, a Lizardfolk Warrior 2/Druid 2 is only CR 4. And he has 2 racial HD, 2 Warrior HD, and 2 Druid HD.

If they are middle aged, then they get a handy +1 to all mental stats. The bonuses they get to physical ability scores offset the penalties from aging.

 

[Nazhkandrias]

Well, I won't lie, the race I have in mind is very similar to Lizardfolk, but flavorwise, they're more like a more societally advanced form of Lizardfolk. Plus, I'm trying to avoid Racial HD here. What I'm looking to create is an easy-to-play from level 1 (no HD, no LA) race for players who want to go for a serene people, freed from the corruptions of humanity and civilization. Lizardfolk sort of belong in the wilderness (low Int, survivalist view on life), whereas my race just chooses to be there, for spiritual reasons. Plus, rather than making them Lizardfolk, I'm curious to see how they will INTERACT with Lizardfolk. Finally, the options I put above are just concerning mechanics. The race will have a few other features for flavor, which I will not include here (since I might be publishing this), but I assure you, they won't be very significant at all. Just cool.

 

[akbearfoot]

Do you intend for them to be wise but dull and clumsy? Doesen't strike me as very efficient for a race to evolve into something thats naturally clumsy and slow and happens to have a favored class(maybe at least) that specializes in archery?

I'd say make it +2wis -2Int -2cha, to represent their spiritual nature. They pass on knowlege by word of mouth, tribal stories etc, rather than writing all their knowlege into books for studying...and due to their strange appearance or seperation from 'civilized' society they've grown to be mildly xenophibic translating into -2charisma.


I'd say let them keep their 30ft movement, and give them a 20ft swim spead, but only if they are in light or no armor, similar to barbarians bonus movement...If they are in bulky armor or encumbered it impedes their natural abilities....20 ft move sucks hardcore just ask any of the smallfolk.

Is a natural armor bonus that important to you? I'd say drop it...the fact that you dont want them to have racial hitdice sort of says they are not meant to be tougher or more robust than normal.

They'd get the normal racial bonus to swim(I forget but IIRC its 8 normally) Any more racial boni and it seems ot be getting a little overpowered for a +0. The Hold breath ability is hardly ever likely to come up, and it's more a flavor ability imo so that's fine.

Low light vision is good, and makes sense I spose. You could probably get away with it though.


If you wanted to give them some sort of vulnerability...say to cold for instance(maybe they are cold blooded) Like +2 damage per die from cold based attacks, then you could get away with some of those other racial bonuses...+2survival +2knowlege(nature) (basically a virtual feat) and it would put it back down closer to a solid +0.

 

[Nifft]

I was wondering, would a Wisdom bonus be appropriate here, for an LA +0 creature?

No, never. Same for Int and Cha bonuses.

There probably are some somewhere, in a splatbook or monster manual, but they're not balanced due to how D&D 3.x handles spellcasting.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Nazhkandrias]

Do you intend for them to be wise but dull and clumsy? Doesen't strike me as very efficient for a race to evolve into something thats naturally clumsy and slow and happens to have a favored class(maybe at least) that specializes in archery?

No, I was going for in-tune with their surroundings and nature (so yes, wise), but not so much clumsy as ponderous and deliberate. They just move on a slightly slower scale than other races, sort of like nature itself (I intend to give long lifespans to complement this). Plus, Rangers don't necessarily need to specialize in archery. Odds are, most of them would focus on Two-Weapon Fighting, or perhaps an additional style created with their abilities in mind. As for Charisma, I was thinking that they aren't necessarily xenophobic as introverted and a little withdrawn. Silence is golden, and sometimes talking gets in the way of thinking or observing. I was seriously considering giving a penalty to Intelligence, as per your suggestion, but it just didn't fit with the view I had of them. They aren't unintelligent, and while they might not have the most elaborate written tradition, they're still as capable as anybody when it comes to cognitive thinking and learning. It sort of fits into my "outcasts by choice" image.

No, never. Same for Int and Cha bonuses.

Hmm, what a shame. It seems so... limiting to have that being a fact of life. I guess that I was hoping to be the first. Ah well, it might be acceptable under certain circumstances, and these guys still make good NPCs. Still, there has to be SOME way to make this work. Any other ideas out there?

 

[Nifft]

Hmm, what a shame. It seems so... limiting to have that being a fact of life. I guess that I was hoping to be the first. Ah well, it might be acceptable under certain circumstances, and these guys still make good NPCs. Still, there has to be SOME way to make this work. Any other ideas out there?

Yeah, it's very annoying. SW Saga doesn't have this problem, thanks to the way "magic" works. But in D&D, being a primary spellcaster means only caring about one stat (and Con, and maybe Dex).

Suggestion: racial substitution levels for whatever classes you want them to be good at, like Druid and Ranger.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Hypersmurf]

It's just that mental bonuses can really be an issue, since they give huge advantages to casters, and I can't think of any LA +0 races that have mental bonuses period (save for Gray Elves, but that's for Intelligence).

I think you're after Wisdom Elves.

They're an obscure Elven subrace, named after the fact that they get a Wisdom bonus. (All the other words in the English language had already been used for other elven subraces, hence the unoriginal name.)

-Hyp.

 

[Zurai]

But in D&D, being a primary spellcaster means only caring about one stat (and Con, and maybe Dex).

Favored Soul. Archivist. Warmage. There are more split-stat primary casters than there are single-stat ones, actually.

Wizard, Sorceror, Cleric, and Druid are the only SAD full casters that I know of.

 

[Nifft]

Wizard, Sorceror, Cleric, and Druid are the only SAD full casters that I know of.

Funny how those seem to crop up in so many games.

(But also see Psion, Wilder, and Erudite.)

Cheers, -- N