D&D General [rant]The conservatism of D&D fans is exhausting.

[Maxperson]

Meh, playing pretend is a bit childish, no?

No. It really depends on what you are doing. Pretend cops and robbers, sure. That's childish. RPGs? No. That's not inherently childish. Pretend roleplaying at work to learn a process? Also not childish.

I don't really see that as disparaging.

When you are calling something that is not childish, childish, that's disparaging.

I mean, if you see it that way, okay... then I guess I that explains your take. But it seems a bit of a stretch and is literally what he's clarifying in the quote. It requires ignoring his point in favor of maintaining your own interpretation.

No. The author can 1) see that it's disparaging, which is why he has to pre-emptively defend himself, and 2) knows that it's so disparaging, that he felt that he had to pre-emptively attack anyone who might be offended.

I'm sorry, but if you know it looks that bad, maybe don't use the term and choose something neutral instead.

 

[Maxperson]

I have seen narrative play referred to as "story hour", just not in this thread.

In common parlance, narrative play gets called "not roleplaying", "story telling" and other derogatory things, too.

While any particular author may be biased in their approach - disparaging to some styles but not others - broadly speaking, all sides have disparaging ways they refer to each other's playstyle preferences, and we should not suggest otherwise. This behavior is typical to tribalism, and to any Us vs Them (or In-group vs Out-group) dynamic.

No playstyle choice completely filters for people so highly socially developed as to never take part in such shenanigans.

Yeah. I've seen disparagement from the traditional players as well. I can say that I have seen much more from the narrative folks, though. Also, it happening on both sides doesn't really excuse the terminology being used in that article.

It should stop from all directions, not be tolerated and continued.

 

[Umbran]

Yeah. I've seen disparagement from the traditional players as well. I can say that I have seen much more from the narrative folks, though. Also, it happening on both sides doesn't really excuse the terminology being used in that article.

Yeah, the point isn't to excuse, but just to note that it isn't really about the article, or about one side of the discussion. This is a crummy way people behave, in general, and is one of the reasons we can't have nice things.

 

[Maxperson]

An adult worries about what someone says about their hobbies IF those hobbies are being used as an attack on your comportment or competence.

That's what the disparaging comments about playstyles are.

 

[Maxperson]

Maybe I'm misreading the quote. But to me, it isn’t calling you childish for caring what people say about your hobbies, but instead advocating that it's childish to be ashamed of what you genuinely love, just because it might seem “childish” to others.

Which is fair. I'm not at all ashamed of my playstyle or playing D&D. However, that does not mean that it's okay to disparage what I do or that I shouldn't push back at such disparagement.

 

[hawkeyefan]

No. It really depends on what you are doing. Pretend cops and robbers, sure. That's childish. RPGs? No. That's not inherently childish. Pretend roleplaying at work to learn a process? Also not childish.

I'm saying that playing pretend is typically associated with children. However, I don't consider that comparison to be negative.

There are plenty of things children do that I think adults would be wise to remember.

When you are calling something that is not childish, childish, that's disparaging.

Not if you don't think that the word childish is itself disparaging.

No. The author can 1) see that it's disparaging, which is why he has to pre-emptively defend himself, and 2) knows that it's so disparaging, that he felt that he had to pre-emptively attack anyone who might be offended.

I'm sorry, but if you know it looks that bad, maybe don't use the term and choose something neutral instead.

Or, he recognizes that many folks, such as you, will view comparison to a children's activity as disparaging, and he's explaining why it is in fact not so.

Honestly, I think generally speaking, we should all stop trying to work so hard to be insulted. Especially in cases where there is clearly no insult intended.

 

[JConstantine]

It seems more like saying, "don’t let other people’s rudeness, mockery, or judgment threaten your joy." Which seems applicable to the thread.

Quite. My father's current wife once asked me (in a somewhat judgemental tone) if I didn't think it was childish to be eating a certain chocolate dessert, to which I simply responded that it was no more childish than her eating crisps/chips that used a cartoon mascot. It seemed to drive the point home.

 

[Faolyn]

Umbran first said, 'it suggests that their experience without it[fail forward] has had many boring bits.'

Is that assessment incorrect?

I apologize, then; I misunderstood.

 

[JConstantine]

Pretend cops and robbers, sure. That's childish.

Does this not rather imply that LARP is childish? Seems to me you are doing exactly what you are complaining about.

 

[Faolyn]

I don't know what a cozy RPG is, but I'm not sold on the suggestion that a tea party cannot have rising conflict simply by virtue of it being a tea party. It obviously won't be the same kind of content rising conflict i'm accustomed to, but there's nothing inherent about tea parties that seem to preclude it?

They're usually about low-key, mellow situations, including things like tea parties, household events, and comfortable things. Most of them do have things that cause tension and raise the stakes, these are generally things like family issues, not combat or having to save lives.