Readied actions

[deleteme123456]

Me & another DM are working on a list of house rules for our group.

We're trying to shut down (although it hasn't happened yet and probably won't, we're of the opinion that if we told you up front that it doesn't work, you're less likely to be cranky later if we say it doesn't work) this sort of scenario:

Rogue: (moves next to enemy X). I ready Reflex Strike vs X for after the Cleric attacks.
Cleric: I use Righteous Brand on X. If it hits, I give the power bonus to the rogue.
Rogue: My readied action goes off, and I attack with a power bonus...

Because the Rogue interrupted the Cleric's turn, the Rogue is ahead of the Cleric, and the benefit is in effect until the end of the Cleric's next turn, which won't be until after the Rogue has a 2nd turn with the power bonus.

We were going to have readying put you after, but that doesn't stop it...

Cleric: I ready Righteous Brand for when the Rogue is next to X.
Rogue (moves next to X).
Cleric: (uses readied action)
Rogue: attacks with power.

If the cleric is moved to after the rogue, we're back to the original problem.

Ideally the rule would be simple but work without changing too much else. Any ideas for how to phrase it?

 

[Omnifarious Grey]

I would just eliminate that sort of thing, or better yet, if you use the readied action to take a standard action, place that person into the initiative where they took their action. This is always how I saw it and makes sense to me.

 

[deleteme123456]

Well, you want to allow readied action -> standard action because it's very reasonable to say "I ready (some power) for when (my ally) moves into flanking" (especially if you're a rogue).

But like I showed, if you put the interrupter before the interruptee or after doesn't matter, with the right triggers it can still be done, and since they can't be placed in initiative order in the middle of someone else's turn, those are basically the options.

 

[DanmarLOK]

I'm not sure what problem you're trying to fix unfortunately? These are valid actions on the parts of the players. Okay I think I see what you're saying, it's the timing and interupt of the ready action.

In this case [A readied action is an immediate reaction. It takes place after your enemy completes the action that triggers it.] So that alone should prevent the entire scenario since the cleric isn't the rogues enemy?

It's not an issue so much with readied actions, the characters can simply change their initiative order so that the rogue always goes after the cleric. So it becomes -

Player A - I use power A and give bonus B to player C
Player C - I move to monster D and attack with power E using the bonus.

 

[deleteme123456]

RAW it's possible to get the bonus twice if it's a bonus that lasts until the end of the cleric's next turn.

Rogue: I ready power A against monster B after the Cleric attacks B. (ends turn)
(any number of intervening players and/or monsters)
Cleric: I attack monster B (and hit), giving a power bonus to the Rogue until the end of my next turn.
Rogue: I interrupt the Cleric's turn and take my readied action with the power bonus. (this moves the Rogue into order immediately ahead of the cleric).
Cleric: I finish my turn.
...any number of other monsters/players...
Rogue's next turn: I attack B again with the same power bonus.
Cleric's next turn: I do whatever and end my turn. The power bonus wears off now.

See how the rogue tricked the system into letting him have the power bonus twice?

 

[fissionessence]

Phrase the power like this:

Righteous Brand | Cleric Attack 1
[snip]
Hit: 1[W] + Strength modifier damage, and one ally within 5 squares of you gains a power bonus to melee attack rolls against the target equal to your Strength modifier, beginning at the end of this turn and lasting until the end of your next turn.

The bonus doesn't come into play until the end of the cleric's current turn, and so the readied action won't get the bonus.

~ fissionessence

 

[Omnifarious Grey]

I think you only have a problem if you interpret a readied action to immediately happen even in the middle of a player's turn, and if that action is supposed to place the readied action character "before" the player's turn they interrupt.

Change things around so that the character can't use his action during another players turn and that player has to complete the turn first, or if you don't like that idea just make sure you place the readied action player "After" the player's turn they are interrupting.

 

[fissionessence]

I think you only have a problem if you interpret a readied action to immediately happen even in the middle of a player's turn, and if that action is supposed to place the readied action character "before" the player's turn they interrupt.

That's how the rules work.

Change things around so that the character can't use his action during another players turn and that player has to complete the turn first, or if you don't like that idea just make sure you place the readied action player "After" the player's turn they are interrupting.

Neither of those 'solutions' rectifies the problem at hand, as mentioned in the OP.

~

 

[Omnifarious Grey]

Understandable, but even if the RAW states that the OP scenario works like that, I still would not allow such a thing and would simply make the changes that I suggested. If you make the readied action player take the initiative spot "after" the player's turn he interupted, then there wouldn't be an issue for a double bonus to come into effect.

 

[deleteme123456]

Understandable, but even if the RAW states that the OP scenario works like that, I still would not allow such a thing and would simply make the changes that I suggested. If you make the readied action player take the initiative spot "after" the player's turn he interupted, then there wouldn't be an issue for a double bonus to come into effect.

See scenario two in my OP. The Cleric now interrupts the Rogue instead of v.v. I've sketched in "any power which grants a bonus to any an ally with any duration other than immediate begins at the end of the current player's turn." The other DM will have a day or so to come up with a loophole for that one.