Sculpt Spell: possibly problematic

[Deset Gled]

I would follow the normal stacking rules for overlapping cubes: "In cases when two or more identical spells are operating in the same area or on the same target, but at different strengths, only the best one applies. " The four cubes are all "identical spells", so only the best one applies. Of course, since they're all the same spell (and hence, onle one roll), this won't help much.

 

[Nebten]

There is only 1 offical FAQ

 

[frankthedm]

The FAQ would be worth something. Got a link?

I was incorrect about it being in the faq. Now I am annoyed because that means my brain is getting fuzzy.

 

[Vegepygmy]

I would follow the normal stacking rules for overlapping cubes: "In cases when two or more identical spells are operating in the same area or on the same target, but at different strengths, only the best one applies. " The four cubes are all "identical spells", so only the best one applies.

I can't concur with your logic. Fireball is an instantaneous spell, so the "normal stacking rules" say the effects would be cumulative (if they are indeed two separate spells).

Of course, since they're all the same spell (and hence, onle one roll), this won't help much.

This is the reason you can't stack the damage using Sculpt Spell. It is still only one spell, and the "instantaneous effects" rule (PHB, page 172) specifies that: "Two or more spells with instantaneous duration work cumulatively when they affect the same target."

 

[Thanee]

The cubes do not deal damage. The spell does. To any target in the area specified by placing the cubes.

If you overlap the cubes, congratulations, you just got a smaller spell area. That's it!

Bye
Thanee

 

[Thanee]

My immediate instinct is that this isn't an issue at all. Think of it this way: You have four 10-foot cubes made of fire. You can't "stack" them in the same area any more than you could stack metal cubes that way. Two three-dimensional objects can't simultaneously occupy the same three-dimensional space!

So you can't place the cubes where creatures are? Would make the spell pretty weak.

Bye
Thanee

 

[NewJeffCT]

So you can't place the cubes where creatures are? Would make the spell pretty weak.

Bye
Thanee

There is a psionic effect (Energy Barrage?) that creates three 10 foot radius spreads, and the descriptor notes that you can overlap the spreads and can cause the target(s) to make up to 3 Reflex saves. But, psionics is sometimes a bit of a different animal.

Edited to add: A bit offtopic, but on Firestorm, it is listed as "S" for Shape-able, does that mean you can create it how you wish - i.e., if I wanted it shaped like a wall of Ws, I could do that? Meaning, if you had a spreadsheet of square boxes, cell A1, B2, C1, D2, E1, etc, etc.

 

[Vegepygmy]

A bit offtopic, but on Firestorm, it is listed as "S" for Shape-able, does that mean you can create it how you wish - i.e., if I wanted it shaped like a wall of Ws, I could do that? Meaning, if you had a spreadsheet of square boxes, cell A1, B2, C1, D2, E1, etc, etc.

"Shapeable" is defined/explained on page 176 of the PHB.

(And good answer, Thanee, by the way. I was trying to think of a succinct way to say exactly that, and couldn't do nearly as well as you did.)

 

[Thanee]

There is a psionic effect (Energy Barrage?) that creates three 10 foot radius spreads, and the descriptor notes that you can overlap the spreads and can cause the target(s) to make up to 3 Reflex saves. But, psionics is sometimes a bit of a different animal.

Meteor Swarm does that, too.

The point is, that if a spell or power specifically says so, then - of course - it works that way.

But in general, it does not.

Bye
Thanee

 

[pawsplay]

Sorry, guys, I have yet to see anything in the rules that says cubes can not overlap.

- Some abilities, like Meteor Swarm, can overlap
- Most shapeable spells can not, as they must be contiguous cubes, typically
- Some spells have areas in cubes because they are three dimensional
- There are some rules for overlapping spells which are not really helpful in this case, unless you choose to interepret multiple areas as being like multiple spells, in which case you have a solution for spells that offer a save and are not instantaneous.
- Sculpted spells are definitely not like "physical cubes," especially in the case of sculpted spells that produce instant effects or bursts.
- If you are in the area of a spell, it affects you.

The crux of the matter:
- If a spell affects you if you are in its area, and you are in its area four times, it affects you four times.
- But if a spell affects you if you are in its area, and being in any of the cubes makes you in the area one time, it affects you one time.

And the rules do not actually state what the answer is. The rules do not say, exactly, that a spell can affect you more than once in a turn. But neither do they say that being affected by being in a spell's area is something that can only happen once. In the absence of a rule otherwise, it would appear that the default answer would be, "You are affected by being in the area, you are in the area (execute subroutine 'You are affected by the spell'), you are in the area, you are in the area, you are in the area." The default reading appears to be inadequate in this case.

It seems like there are three possible choices:
- Reword the feat so that the cubes have to be contiguous, that is, they are sculpted into a 3D shape
- Accept that the spell creates four cube "spell warheads" and allow them to work cumulatively as though they were separate spells.
- Allow that the spell creates four cubical spell warheads, but arbitrarily rule that they do not work cumulatively as though they were separate spells even if they are instantaneous and the "overlap" rules do not adequately cover the situation. Instead, just claim the spell has no cumulative effect. Ignore questions like whether a piece of bread set between two "cubes" of Fireball gets toasted on both sides or why four cubed fireballs do as much damage to four different areas as one fireball does to an area 1/4 the size.