jonathonhawke
Explorer
Can you take the second Cybernetics talent after level 1?
Shadowrun using DnD5 [OOC]
- Thread starter GreenKarl
- Start date
Can you take the second Cybernetics talent after level 1?
Yes, if you noted in the Character Creation part I mentioned that while the characters where starting at 3rd level you are still considered Starting Characters for various feats, etc. Its not a big deal here as she could have taken the cybernetics at 1st and the Crafty Action on 3rd...
jonathonhawke
Explorer
I asked cuz I wasn't sure.
Binder Fred
3 rings to bind them all!
Hey there GK. Went over gear and spells.
Some questions/comments:
Are strain points gained from drug-use permanent or can they be removed/healed with time?
Jazz's elimination of Exhaustion levels seems to lead to infinite MPs for magic users? (Don't mind if I do
Do we add our proficiency bonus to damage? I seem to remember doing that in 5E SW but I can't find it here...
Armor:
Requiring training to not get disadvantage on every action for wearing an armored business suit or a lined jacket seems excessive. Considering the usual SR lethality, I think I'd either put all Light armor into the Protective Gear category (no training necessary) or give all classes Light Armor proficiency? I feel naked!
The armor spell is severely underpowered, especially considering Magic-User's lack of physical armor (see above). Perhaps making it scalable with added Magnitude maybe (+X AC per Mag)?
As is I'm thinking multiclassing Fighter *might* be the way to go for Intensity?
Spells:
Casters are heavily restricted in their number of spells known AND number of spells they can cast each day (by both MP, exhaustion levels and/or HPs). I'd suggest leaning a little bit more on the versatility side by granting 2 (or even 3) new spells per New Spell feat?
Some questions/comments:
Are strain points gained from drug-use permanent or can they be removed/healed with time?
Jazz's elimination of Exhaustion levels seems to lead to infinite MPs for magic users? (Don't mind if I do
Do we add our proficiency bonus to damage? I seem to remember doing that in 5E SW but I can't find it here...
Armor:
Requiring training to not get disadvantage on every action for wearing an armored business suit or a lined jacket seems excessive. Considering the usual SR lethality, I think I'd either put all Light armor into the Protective Gear category (no training necessary) or give all classes Light Armor proficiency? I feel naked!
The armor spell is severely underpowered, especially considering Magic-User's lack of physical armor (see above). Perhaps making it scalable with added Magnitude maybe (+X AC per Mag)?
As is I'm thinking multiclassing Fighter *might* be the way to go for Intensity?
Spells:
Casters are heavily restricted in their number of spells known AND number of spells they can cast each day (by both MP, exhaustion levels and/or HPs). I'd suggest leaning a little bit more on the versatility side by granting 2 (or even 3) new spells per New Spell feat?
There is Cyber-Psychic Alignment that lets you ignore Strain. I might be open to healing it but would have to figure out what is a fair way. In Shadowrun is was VERY dangerous for mages to use Sim patches, etc. as in the early days it lead to Burn-Out, which is something I kind of liked. But maybe...
I am open to the idea of moving Armored Business Suites back down to Protective clothing... maybe a reinforced one should only be Light Armor.
Hmm let me think about the Armor spell some more. I could see bumping it to AC 14 + dexterity modifier but not much more. The hardness has the advantage of working also verse magical spell damage.
As for Spells hmmm maybe I could see two but I want to think about it. Remember you can get Magic Points back even with just a short rest, no other costs. Feats like Quick Refresh and Meditation can get you back more. And if at 4th level you raised your Wisdom up to 16 that could get you a bump of 6 points alone (+3 for 3rd level and another 3 from previous levels).
Maybe lets see how some of it good for the first adventure and then we can adjust if it is not working and too harsh on my part.
I am open to the idea of moving Armored Business Suites back down to Protective clothing... maybe a reinforced one should only be Light Armor.
Hmm let me think about the Armor spell some more. I could see bumping it to AC 14 + dexterity modifier but not much more. The hardness has the advantage of working also verse magical spell damage.
As for Spells hmmm maybe I could see two but I want to think about it. Remember you can get Magic Points back even with just a short rest, no other costs. Feats like Quick Refresh and Meditation can get you back more. And if at 4th level you raised your Wisdom up to 16 that could get you a bump of 6 points alone (+3 for 3rd level and another 3 from previous levels).
Maybe lets see how some of it good for the first adventure and then we can adjust if it is not working and too harsh on my part.
OK so I agreed enough with the idea of moving the Armored Business suit into Protective gear. I did not add a reinforced one yet. Still debating on that one.
I also agree with New Spells and the feat will grant two new spells each time you take the feat.
The rest I want to sort of wait and see...
I also agree with New Spells and the feat will grant two new spells each time you take the feat.
The rest I want to sort of wait and see...
Binder Fred
3 rings to bind them all!
Still struggling a bit with my character build: thought taking a level of Tough would solve my defensive woes, which it did, but then realized that'd mean loosing his Mentor Spirit Talent... Back to the drawing board.
Comments and suggestions:
Touch weapon property could use a little flexibility, I think. Something like: "User can choose to either take +2 tohit without Str or Dex bonuses to damage (light touch version) OR add their usual bonuses to attack and damage ('hit them with the stun stick over the head' version)"? Makes sense in a RL kind of way too.
Lots of Feats to get bonuses on melee and range attacks, but none for Conjuring or Casting... A deliberate choice? Maybe feats that up your Cha (only with spirits), or extending some of the combat-oriented bonuses to include spell-casting attack rolls? In general, as is it seems impossible to get a magic-user's Casting and Conjuring bonuses up to the +7 heights the other PCs all have in their main area of expertise. (Apparently the best conjurers are elves, the best hermetic casters are humans (though not very), and the best shaman casters are dwarves... uh.)
Cyberware beneficial for magic-users? Temporary Int, Wis or Cha overdrives? Parallel passive processing or schizophrenic mind-splits to quicken/anchor (1) spells or spirits? Or maye Damage Comp that works with overcasting damage?
Multiclassing: I think you're missing "Skill" in the 2 proficiency choices? Maybe also add "Equipment" to the list of 2 proficiencies you can choose? Maybe bundle up Tools and Languages together while we're at it since they aren't much by themselves?
So. Much. Stuff! My god, you must have spent an eternity on this...
Comments and suggestions:
Touch weapon property could use a little flexibility, I think. Something like: "User can choose to either take +2 tohit without Str or Dex bonuses to damage (light touch version) OR add their usual bonuses to attack and damage ('hit them with the stun stick over the head' version)"? Makes sense in a RL kind of way too.
Lots of Feats to get bonuses on melee and range attacks, but none for Conjuring or Casting... A deliberate choice? Maybe feats that up your Cha (only with spirits), or extending some of the combat-oriented bonuses to include spell-casting attack rolls? In general, as is it seems impossible to get a magic-user's Casting and Conjuring bonuses up to the +7 heights the other PCs all have in their main area of expertise. (Apparently the best conjurers are elves, the best hermetic casters are humans (though not very), and the best shaman casters are dwarves... uh.)
Cyberware beneficial for magic-users? Temporary Int, Wis or Cha overdrives? Parallel passive processing or schizophrenic mind-splits to quicken/anchor (1) spells or spirits? Or maye Damage Comp that works with overcasting damage?
Multiclassing: I think you're missing "Skill" in the 2 proficiency choices? Maybe also add "Equipment" to the list of 2 proficiencies you can choose? Maybe bundle up Tools and Languages together while we're at it since they aren't much by themselves?
So. Much. Stuff! My god, you must have spent an eternity on this...
Good stuff Bind... lots to more to think about. Yes I kind of left off a lot of bonuses to magical attacks and saving throws. Part of it was in DnD5 there a number of class abilities and even feats that grant some bonus to normal combat (like Battle Master stuff and Fighting Styles) there don't seem to be many that give them to spell casting (except more times to cast and a few that can give a very small bonus to damage like the Elemental master that makes your 1s on damage rolls 2). Make some suggestions and I am open to them.
As for Armor and all the other concentration spells. DnD5 is pretty heavy on them and they a balancing issue I think. In Shadowrun no spell can be sustained longer then while the mage is concentration on it. However they do allow a mage to concentrate on more then one spell at a time. I am thinking on dropping or modifying most of the talents for Concentration and doing something like this...
"A Magic user can concentrate to maintain a number of Spells equal to its traditions defining attribute modifier. However when doing so the mage suffers an -2 to its Concentration saving throw for every spell past the 1st that it is maintaining at the time. Failure results in all spells that the mage is maintaining to fail."
Now there is combat caster feat to give you advantage on the save but maybe a few other or feats could also add some to it. Maybe Sustaining Focuses would mean that you don't need to make a Concentration save if you take damage, at least for the one spell that is being sustained by the focus?
Maybe talents that allow you to maintain another spell or spirit would also give you Expertise on your concentration save when you take damage
I think this might help the difference between 5th and Shadowrun.
As for Armor and all the other concentration spells. DnD5 is pretty heavy on them and they a balancing issue I think. In Shadowrun no spell can be sustained longer then while the mage is concentration on it. However they do allow a mage to concentrate on more then one spell at a time. I am thinking on dropping or modifying most of the talents for Concentration and doing something like this...
"A Magic user can concentrate to maintain a number of Spells equal to its traditions defining attribute modifier. However when doing so the mage suffers an -2 to its Concentration saving throw for every spell past the 1st that it is maintaining at the time. Failure results in all spells that the mage is maintaining to fail."
Now there is combat caster feat to give you advantage on the save but maybe a few other or feats could also add some to it. Maybe Sustaining Focuses would mean that you don't need to make a Concentration save if you take damage, at least for the one spell that is being sustained by the focus?
Maybe talents that allow you to maintain another spell or spirit would also give you Expertise on your concentration save when you take damage
I think this might help the difference between 5th and Shadowrun.
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