D&D 5E (2014) Should martial characters be mundane or supernatural?

[Maxperson]

But the problem is that without any play-affectibg implementation, the DM is within their writes to describe nothing at all, especially since it's impossible for any attack to cause an injury beyond unconscious or dead (or more likely nothing at all).

That's not a problem at all. Of course the DM is within his rights to change it. Just as he's within his rights to change any mechanic that might have been there. Discussions like these aren't about homebrew rules. They're about what is written, and what is written clearly shows what WotC intended as far as narrating hit points goes.

 

[Oofta]

They are related when people are willing to abstract realism to get something they like and the other is a thing people won't abstract because its something someone else likes.

One is simplification of something that can never be accurately modeled. The other is changing the entire narrative and nature of theclass.. Completely different.

 

[I'm A Banana]

What system would you suggest? Because I guarantee it won't be realistic. It can't be. It could certainly be more realistic, that doesn't mean it would make the game better for most people.

I don't think anyone wants a different system.

But what some folks might want is that hit points more directly represent something happening in the fiction of the game.

 

[Minigiant]

One is simplification of something that can never be accurately modeled. The other is changing the entire narrative and nature of theclass.. Completely different.

Again that's your opinion and not true.

Goading is in 5e and the community claims the battelmaster is not supernatural.
Sap is going to be in 5e and WOTC is portraying it as mundane.
Both are additive to damage. One is at will even.

There is no logical standing against the abstraction for either an attack for a longer term loss of speed or an at-will attack to Goad.

It's actually simpler than Maneuvers and Superiority dice.
And more logical than a martial stabbing at a giant 10 times when he can only reach their knees.

 

[Oofta]

Again that's your opinion and not true.

Goading is in 5e and the community claims the battelmaster is not supernatural.
Sap is going to be in 5e and WOTC is portraying it as mundane.
Both are additive to damage. One is at will even.

There is no logical standing against the abstraction for either an attack for a longer term loss of speed or an at-will attack to Goad.

It's actually simpler than Maneuvers and Superiority dice.
And more logical than a martial stabbing at a giant 10 times when he can only reach their knees.

I have no issues with some subclasses like battlemaster, eldritch knights or rune knight having supernatural abilities. I don't have any desire to play the first two, but a fighter that knew how to craft custom magic runes? That was kind of a fun character. But I can still play a champion fighter that does none of that if I want.

I simply want to play a guy trying to be a hero with no innate magic or overtly supernatural abilities. Unless of course they can craft magical runes to help them win the day.

 

[Minigiant]

I have no issues with some subclasses like battlemaster, eldritch knights or rune knight having supernatural abilities. I don't have any desire to play the first two, but a fighter that knew how to craft custom magic runes? That was kind of a fun character. But I can still play a champion fighter that does none of that if I want.

I simply want to play a guy trying to be a hero with no innate magic or overtly supernatural abilities. Unless of course they can craft magical runes to help them win the day.

Didn't say you can't play a mundane martial.

Just that the D&D concept of mundane is incomplete and already a bit unrealistic but many in the fandom refuse to expand the mundane even a bit.

 

[Oofta]

Didn't say you can't play a mundane martial.

Just that the D&D concept of mundane is incomplete and already a bit unrealistic but many in the fandom refuse to expand the mundane even a bit.

The entire game is unrealistic. Doesn't mean I want to lose the option to play an action movie hero in armor, not some anime character.

 

[Minigiant]

The entire game is unrealistic. Doesn't mean I want to lose the option to play an action movie hero in armor, not some anime character.

Who says you lose the option? You constantly act if addition to the game takes away existing option.

If you don't like those options, ban them.

 

[Micah Sweet]

In 50 years of D&D, no wound or critical hit system has ever managed to take hold because the vast majority of D&D players (and DMs) have not wanted one. If there had ever been more than a niche market for it, it would have taken hold. It hasn't.

Not my issue. Niche doesn't mean bad.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

And to be a guy who isn't all talk here are mundane martial stuff the martials should be able to do.
Italics ins in D&D
Underlined is mundane actions becoming supernatural in future via barbarian or monk

• Action movie actions
  • Arm/leg/wrist lock takedowns
  • Explosion dodge
  • Instant reload
  • Missile dodge
  • Neck snaps
  • Perfect dodge
  • Pistol whip takeouts
  • Rapid Fire
  • Sniping
• Battlefield Communication
  • Demoralize
  • Feint
  • Rally
  • Point out
  • Risk/Wager
  • Trick
• Count as Large
• Count as Small
• Deadly Critical
  • Trigger Critical hits
  • Critical hits are save or die
  • Enhance critical damage
  • Extend Critical Range
• Enhance items
  • Strengthen Acid
  • Strengthen Alchemist Fire
  • Strengthen Poison
  • Strengthen Potions
• Extend Range
  • Make nonreach melee weapons reach
  • Throw nonthrow weapons
  • Extend ranged attack ranges
• Finishing Moves
• Ground Pounds
• Olympic Actions
  • Basketball
  • High Jump
  • Hurdles
  • Long jump
  • Marathon Run
  • Marathon Swim
  • Sprinting
  • Wrestling
• Ricochet Shots
• Signature Moves
• Waterfall Attacks
• Whirlwind Attacks
• Wuxia actions
• Volleys

Like I said before. It's not a matter of magic or supernatural, D&D is missing a lot of mundane actions

A lot of these would need to be specific manuevers not everyone has, because a lot of people who like martials don’t want the mechanical specificity of a wrist lock takedown. They just want “grapple check, pin, I have this ability so I can deal damage when I grapple or pin.”

Other stuff is already in the game, like evasion is explosion dodging. The rest, could certainly at least be added as “optional special actions” like those in the DMG, but actually given thought and dev time, and some could be worked into what you can do with an attack, and some would be best as class features to boost and distinguish each martial class.

I do think most of it we would just have to accept that casters with weapon combat and tool focused features would be able to pick them up, just like weapon mastery.