D&D General So how do Half-Elfs feel different to Elfs?

[kigmatzomat]

Thats slightly not how it works on the elf side.

The elven parents would be 100 years or more because in D&D, elves are considered minors socially until age 100 despite being physically adult since age 20-25.

Go reread what I wrote. The elven parents were 175yro (human equivalent to 25yro).

So Mike NEVER sees Evan because Evan's mother has him in the Elflands until age 100.

Most elves may live in the elven lands, but not all. Otherwise there are no half-elves. If Hank's elven parent lives in the human lands to be with their human-lover, there's no reason an elven sibling might not join them for a century or so. (Or this is a very weird polycule with 2 humans and 2 elves)

Setting to setting, intermixing of races in communities varies quite a bit.

 

[Minigiant]

Most elves may live in the elven lands, but not all. Otherwise there are no half-elves. If Hank's elven parent lives in the human lands to be with their human-lover, there's no reason an elven sibling might not join them for a century or so. (Or this is a very weird polycule with 2 humans and 2 elves)

My point is the full human might never meet his full elven half brother.

Unless its a weird species polycule.

 

[Sorinth]

Or, put another way:

A 30 year old human today would probably not remember the 20th century at all. Their earliest historical memory might be the 2008 Crash or the Arab Spring.

An equally mature half-elf would have been born in 1970 or so, and would remember the Cold War, the Fall of the Berlin Wall and 9/11, as well as Black Monday.

An equally mature elf would 150-200 years old; ie born before World War One at least, and probably remembering the buildup to it if their parents talked about it at dinner.

The just have a massively different view of history.

I've never really liked this type this type of equivalency because if it takes an elf 80 years to mature mentally then nothing related to memory is going to have a human equivalency simply because if they could form memories like humans do, they wouldn't need 80 years to mature.

Also since sleep is intricately related to creating memories for humans, it's safe to say everything about memories is going to be vastly different for creatures who trance instead.

While I don't think it's official in any way I would posit that trancing is how elves create long term memories and therefore when they are children (<80) and haven't learnt how to trance yet they won't really be creating proper long term memories. So while an older elf can still remember things that happened centuries ago and therefore have a very different outlook because of it, they don't remember sitting around the dinner table with their parents, or a favourite childhood toy like a human might.

 

[Hriston]

No, I understood, I was just “yes, but”ing your point. I was saying, yes, humans ought to recognize half-elves as members of their own race, as Aragorn is doing in your example.

That's not my point. I'm not saying and don't agree that Aragorn is recognizing Elrond as human. I'm saying that Aragorn is recognizing himself as Half-elven. When he says "our race", he is talking about the race of the Half-elven of which he (Aragorn) is a member. For reference, here's a link to the Tolkien Gateway article on Kinship of the Half-elven which is a family tree and explanatory note that were enclosed in a letter in 1964. Notice that the part of the tree showing the Half-elven, including Aragorn, as well as the note about them, is done in green ink. Also, that Men on the tree are in black ink and that Elves are in orange.

As I said, I'm merely mentioning this as an alternative to the "halfbreed" narrative, which has its place but is not the only story you can tell about half-elves. Imagine a society of made up of humans and elves living in close proximity and that over a long period of time, they intermarry to the point where everyone in the society is of mixed ancestry. This would be a society of Half-elves with its own identity to which its members would belong.

Eta: To be fair, you can see a little of the "torn between two worlds" with Aragorn in the love triangle with Eowyn and Arwen, although Aragorn is never truly torn because Arwen is the obviously superior choice, but maybe the reader is a little.

 

[Piperken]

...which got me thinking in terms of actual playability what is the difference between an Elf and a Half-Elf, is there anything that actually distinguishes one from the other? or is it just the choice of mechanics?

I can see how Drow might be different to standard Elf, but cant really think of anything other than the contrived "feels like an outsider" to differentiate Half-Elf (but most monsters ought to feel that way).

Two points that may not been touched on with great depth:

• Depending on edition, classes you could play in D&D were either locked entirely, or limited by level, based off what race you picked. Further complicating this was if you wanted to multiclass, meeting the prerequisites was easier if you went with particular race/class combinations. These mechanics left an impression generally through the editions as to why someone might pick an elf versus half-elf (or another race).
• Depending on setting, or individual players' constellations of ideas surrounding elves, some found elves too otherworldly and hard to portray. Maybe they didn't have much experience playing them. Or for whatever reason, bounced off an elf being emblematic of the character in their head. A half-elf is easier in terms of comfort.

I played half-elves and half-orcs for many of the reasons people mentioned above, including having a diverse family. While exploring that option in roleplaying games is certainly of value, I'm very happy that there are a much wider range of experiences characters can now have, that aren't tied explicitly to what a player happened to choose at creation.

 

[Misanthrope Prime]

Is there a difference between a Mestizo, a Casta, a Peninsular, a Hapa, an Indo, a Creole or a Khoravar?

Back when wotc removed half races from the phb I know I started a lot of posts off here saying "as a mixed race person" but uh... As a mixed race person, I've always felt drawn to half elves precisely because I have an experience being othered in many places that my parents would not be: and because of that I've found myself finding community in places that others might not have expected. I speak many languages, have many skills and feel a personal connection to many places of great history and power across this earth.

Why wouldn't someone of mixed elf heritage have an experience similar to mine, one I think is unique and worth cherishing, especially if they're from a global city like I am (As a mixed race New Yorker I can't help but play a character who is effusively and obnoxiously from a big city like Waterdeep, Sigil or Greyhawk).

 

[Misanthrope Prime]

Not only is this mere pedantry, it’s wrong pedantry, and this kind of silliness is why I was opposed to species being the term used to replace race in 2024.

The way different fantasy peoples relate to each other in D&D has never really reflected how different species relate to each other in real life. Moreover, the idea that what separates species in real life is interbreedability is an oversimplification. It is often, but not always, true that animals of different species can’t produce viable offspring together, and that is certainly not what defines species. Species doesn’t really have a single fixed definition, it’s ultimately (as all categories are) a social construct that we use to sort animals into distinct kinds. The criteria we use to do that sorting has changed over time and in all likelihood will continue to change over time, and isn’t even fully consistent between disciplines. How an entomologist distinguishes species of insects is very different than how a paleontologist distinguishes species of dinosaur, for example. And all of that is very, very irrelevant to whether the children of imaginary creatures like elves and orcs can have babies together.

The way d&d species interact probably isn't terribly different from how anatomically modern humans interacted with other hominins like neanderthals. We fought, spoke, lived and even mated with other members of the human genus even if homo sapiens sapiens is the only one that remains.

I personally use "hominins" as a synonym for race in my home games (unless you're like a plasmoid) but different cross fertile hominins would both be difference species and yet still human.

 

[Charlaquin]

That's not my point. I'm not saying and don't agree that Aragorn is recognizing Elrond as human. I'm saying that Aragorn is recognizing himself as Half-elven. When he says "our race", he is talking about the race of the Half-elven of which he (Aragorn) is a member. For reference, here's a link to the Tolkien Gateway article on Kinship of the Half-elven which is a family tree and explanatory note that were enclosed in a letter in 1964. Notice that the part of the tree showing the Half-elven, including Aragorn, as well as the note about them, is done in green ink. Also, that Men on the tree are in black ink and that Elves are in orange.

As I said, I'm merely mentioning this as an alternative to the "halfbreed" narrative, which has its place but is not the only story you can tell about half-elves. Imagine a society of made up of humans and elves living in close proximity and that over a long period of time, they intermarry to the point where everyone in the society is of mixed ancestry. This would be a society of Half-elves with its own identity to which its members would belong.

Eta: To be fair, you can see a little of the "torn between two worlds" with Aragorn in the love triangle with Eowyn and Arwen, although Aragorn is never truly torn because Arwen is the obviously superior choice, but maybe the reader is a little.

This chart rather understates how many generations removed Aragorn is from Elrond, but yes, he does have distant elven heritage. This also implies he and Arwen are very distant cousins, which is a little weird, albeit less so in light of those generations of removal.

 

[Tonguez]

This chart rather understates how many generations removed Aragorn is from Elrond, but yes, he does have distant elven heritage. This also implies he and Arwen are very distant cousins, which is a little weird, albeit less so in light of those generations of removal.

its not that weird really - for Earth its been calculated that any two strangers who meet are likely to have a common ancestor 2000 to 4000 years ago, (which may well be within an Elfs remembered lifetime)

Its also calculated that everyone alive today probably has the same two common ancestors who lived circa 7000 years ago - we are in fact all cousins
But if its any consolation the same studies state that by the 6th cousin generation you are really no more 'genetically related' to one person than you are to anyone else.

 

[Charlaquin]

its not that weird really - for Earth its been calculated that any two strangers who meet are likely to have a common ancestor 2000 to 4000 years ago, (which may well be within an Elfs remembered lifetime)

Its also calculated that everyone alive today probably has the same two common ancestors who lived circa 7000 years ago - we are in fact all cousins
But if its any consolation the same studies state that by the 6th cousin generation you are really no more 'genetically related' to one person than you are to anyone else.

It’s not weird for them to have common ancestors, it’s weird for them to be first cousins 60 times removed. Usually people aren’t alive at the same time as their great, great, (insert 58 more greats) uncle. But if they were, I imagine it might be considered a bit of a social faux pas to marry his daughter, despite the familial relation being plenty distant for the purposes of maintaining genetic diversity.

EDIT: Like, it probably wouldn’t feel weird to Aragorn. But Elrond probably knew his bother and his kids, and their kids, on down the line, and saw them as family. So one of them shacking up with his daughter probably would have seemed kinda icky to him.